EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

Anyone have any opinions of or experience with Pocahontas bred Plotts?

when i was coonhunting it was told to me the pochohantas bred plotts were some of the best around. the pochohantas breds ones were more bear and boar though. not as cold nosed and GRITTY. that's about all the info that i have about them.

The best plott I've hunted with was pochohantas bred not many full plotts suit me no offence intended but she has produced some nice plottxBMC dogs

The thing with the plotts I hunt is that they have more bottom and stick than most of the people I hunt with :o.  If you have small spots of land and a wife that wants you home on time then plotts are not for you.  If you have a low hog population, plenty of land, and a stick with them, run them in the ground, attitude, then plotts may be the way to go.   ;)

25 years ago the Pocahontas line was the best on the Plott breed, they were doing very well in the UKC coon hunts.

The crockett blood is known to be more on the catchy side. A good mix of pocahontas and crockett seem to be the way some of your hog and bear guys are going.  A friend of mine just purchased two pups from West Virginia.  I will get him to post what he and the breeder talked about.  Most of this breeders dogs are pocahontas blooded if i am not mistaken.  This breeder loves the way his pocahontas dogs hunt and the stay that they have.  But definately buy from someone who hunts them and not one who just breeds and takes them to bench shows.  JMO

A while back I remember reading a post of Jim Crainers (thought it was on baydog, but can't find it now) where he mentioned several plott lines, and a few distinctions between them.  He noted a few that were more prone to producing closed mouth hounds.  (Probably closer descendants to the big game lines).

Do the Pocahontas dogs tend to be more tight mouthed as a rule?

would love a tight-mouth plott.
The ones i hunted had excellent nose, run for miles on a cold track, and more bottom than anything.(sizzlin heat bred - and crossed back over to Jim Crainer's good male)
I was younger and not well financed, so i didn't have a tracking system.  
plott  x  no tracking system = bad combination
Lost a real good gyp twice, once for 4 days and another for 3 and both times she was close to dead from running so hard.
She would leave the country  and you could hear her all the way, but she would get out of hearing distance quick like and in a hurry.
Which was another thing that i didn't like, open on track.   :(  We tended to chase longer, baying up less.
Oh well, love their nose, drive, and bottom... just couldn't find the right one to suit me and my hunting preferences being silent til bayed.
I know they are out there and Jim Crainer swears you can train one to be tight mouthed, but it takes a lot more time than i have now to make it happen.

Maver!ck

PS - the guy i sold her to said you couldn't buy the dog from him for any amount of money... said he took her out(he had a tracking system) and she went 5 miles from where they turned out, crossed under Interstate 20 and had a 300# bar bayed by herself for hours before they could get to her and they caught that hog.  :o

The pocahontas dog i tried was too slow and loud for me.  My buddy has a nice sizzlin heat bitch.  She is fast on track but wide open.  I like the crocketts.  They seem to hunt more cur like though that is why i like them.  They have also been quiet for me.  They seem to be real good at finding hogs but some seem to push them a bit, you may need to hunt a couple or have a running catch dog on the ground. 
(http://i46.tinypic.com/2zxsab6.jpg)
sizzlin heat bitch is laying down
(http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i126/ncfatboy22/DSCN0491.jpg)
the brindle dog is my crockett sundance, this was a hunt in fl last winter
Ben

Bought two pocahontas dogs that were a year old and really never out of the pen.  They came from Mr. Walker himself.

One out of Cody II and the other out of Gus.

Both fired up quickly for not really any exposure to game.  I sold the Gus pup to a bear hunter and my buddy was starting the Cody II pup for me.  She was later killed.  The pup was wide open with a booming voice.

I know some of the Cody II dogs are silent and I was hoping  for one.  Mine was wide open.  As far as speed, the line is doing pretty good in the nite hunts, so I know track speed is not a problem.

I would try another and would go back with the cody II line of dogs.

As in all lines, some guys love them to death and some guys hate or dislike them.

i have a 3yr old plott bitch with some sizlin heat and sarge2 in her and she dose well on hogs.she is open but seem to stop and bay in a decent amount of time.usualy half a mile bigger one might have to wear down a bit. but if they wear down she still bayin hard.just picked up a weems x crocket male pup hope he turns out.

Sizzlin heat was the first plott to win it all in the world hunt.

Speed kills.  He was suppose to be a really fast hound.  His write up and history is on plottdogs.com.

Also, I believe that some of the line is pretty quiet.

So there it is, speed and quiet.

The very first hog hunt I ever went on was with a Plott. It was a great dog and found lots of hogs. Bought a pup out of him and it was not any good.

A couple of years ago a Plott came up to work. He had a collar on and we called the number and it had been disconnected. Looked up the other number in the criss cross from the address and it had been disconnected. They were going to take him to the pound so I just took him home.

I don't know how old he is or if he ever hunted hogs before but he took to it. He is a really good strike dog, with bottom and grit. I like the dog and will keep him until he dies.

I picked up two Pocahontas pups a couple months ago directly from Mr. Eugene Walker.  He is Pocahontas Plotts.  The pups I've got are good looking and pretty heavy boned.  Their look leaves no doubt they are hounds. They are 3 months old.  I put a small pig in  their pen a couple weeks ago.  One bayed good while the other bobbed and weaved, but really never barked.  They both caught after a couple minutes.  Mr. Walker breeds for intelligence, speed, heart, and grit.  He doesn't have very many dogs and is not a puppy mill.  His dogs hunt.  They are gritty as hell, but not suicidal.  I saw a couple that he had in recovery from recent bear wounds they got during bear training season.  I contacted him many months in advance and told him what I was looking for in a dog and what I would be using them for.  He told me he would do a breeding that would fit the bill and contact me.  He did everything he said he would and it was a pleasure visiting with him.  If anyone wants pups from him better call him way in advance, he doesn't do many litters.

I've got two other Plotts that are coon bred. They look more like curs than hounds.  One is out of "Trumbos Sandy Hook Smokey."  She is a cull as a hog dog (no grit), but has turned into an excellent blood tracker (really doesn't even need blood).  She will trail anything you put her on.  The other is out of "River Bluff Brindle Cowboy Up."  She is pretty gritty and whines on a hot track or when she sees one.  She runs good with the other dogs and is doing good for an 11 month dog. 

Consensus from the Plott men I've talked to is that Crockett Plotts, on average, are to slow for a hog race, but that when they get there something is definately fixing to happen.

     

so are you planning some crosses?

Nope.  Always just had a fascination with the Plotts.  I believe they are the only hound that was originally and specifically bred for boar hunting.  If memory serves me correctly from what I have read, when the Plott family brought them from Germany to the US, there were no boars to hunt so they started using them on bear and I assume thus began a desire for a more open trailing dog.  I've always heard tale that there are two strains of Plotts...the big game, and those more bred for coon hunting.
In fact, (and I'm relying on a memory that doesn't work that well sometimes) I recall there being some disagreement on hound or cur classification when the breed first became recognized by the registrys.

A few years back, I had a 1/2 Plott dog and I used to love to hear him bay.  Problem with him was he didn't want to hunt on his own.  Just as a novelty, I wouldn't mind having another but problem is that the only time I want to hear that bawl mouth is when the dogs face to face with a hog.

i don't know much about the blood lines of the plotts or even what blood line my plott is, he is silent until bayed, every once in a while, if the hogs breaks he may bark behind it if he can see the hog, not very often though. When i first got him, he would be 10 feet away baying, now he is right in the face, and starting to get a little rough. Like i said i don't know what blood line he comes from, the man that originally owned him lived in south louisinia.
(http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt309/jeffeasttx/ACE036.jpg)
(http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt309/jeffeasttx/DSCI0307.jpg)

I have been looking and researching for several months. The silent ones are rare and prized possesions. I chatted with Buddy Goatcher on here. He has some connections in south La on some proven lines.  If you run across something let me know.  I will have some in the kennels when I find what I want!!
 

Put me on the list to be included on that 'prized' information when u get it as well.
I would love to find a tightmouthed plott.  Love everything about them except the trail barkin'
would own more than one if they were to be found.

Maver!ck

BTW Keyserdawg,

Those are some fine looking hounds.  That Sundance gyp reminds me of my old Abby dog...man, do I miss her!

I went and visited with a guy from South LA this past summer (Mike Cauley, Bayou Cajun).  He and his buddy consistently catch hogs.  The hogs in the areas they hunt are heavy on the Russian side.  He has some great Plott hog dogs as indicated by the stacks of photo albums full of hog pics.  They are hunters and don't breed a bunch to sell, but they will occasionally have pups available.  His adult dogs looked good and from the scars its pretty obvious they have the grit.  Some so gritty they are 1-out dogs.  I don't have any of his stuff yet, but its just a matter of time.

Mike Cauley raises some of the best dogs around.

Alan,

How is the plott pup you got about a year ago working out?

One just turned a year,the other is 9 months.Both are doing good,the older is very quiet,the younger is very loud.The younger one is showing to be a better dog.You couldnt ask for a better put together dog than the older pup.The young one is ugly as they come,but is really starting to show me something. rolleyes

 West,
   When you get tired of one of those plotts give me a call....... I remeber that young one, all ears and elbows!

Yep,and sharp little teeth.Now she is grown up.She is to long bodied,to short legged,and hair like a German Shepard.But she is a go getter when it comes to critters.Seems like all my best dogs are sorta ugly,and put together wrong. ;)

I have had real good sucess with the Alabama hammer line also the sizzlin heat. I had a tiger 2 line gyp that was ruff lot of nose but slow. My buddy has a crocket male and he hunts alot like a cur real  hot nosed.

I wish I could remember the lines that my dad used to have. He had 3 of them shipped down here from washington state out of some big game stock.
They hunted more like cur dogs, and even looked more like a cur. Short ears, hot nosed, and real gritty.
I tried digging up some old pictures but no luck yet.

(http://i887.photobucket.com/albums/ac79/TieEmUpOrLeaveEm/l_e961e307e59b4255b87fc472d032964f.jpg)

This is a pic of my old alabama hammer gyp Brenda was a good hog dog She died last year.

Cascade??

I believe my hunting partner bred the Brenda dog and everything I have comes from close to that same breeding.  They are like al dogs some good some get culled.  Most of them can run.  Man the funniest thing......

If a guy is hunting silent curs and the hog runs for 4 hours they brag about how much bottom the cur dogs have and what a good job they did.

If a guiy is hunting hounds and they run a hog for 4 hours everybody is cussing and fussing saying they should have already stopped the hog and if they were quiet they would have already caught him.

I don't car if he has a monkey riding his back blowing a bugle if he can catch hog.  I actually will get rid of a dog for nor using enough mouth.  Stopping hogs is more about the hogs than the dogs.  I've run hogs for 10 + hours and take the same dogs the next weekend to "fresh" ground where hogs are not pressured and catch 7 or 8.  When ya'll get it all figured out put me on the list for a couple pups....I like to hunt the best I can affordd.  And if I get showed up a couple times I'll switch brands.  Until then I'll keep these Ol plotts around

Yes sir... them dogs didn't stop him in the blown down, root ball or up against the creek bank... he chooses where to stop. ;)

I don't care if he has a monkey riding his back blowing a bugle if he can catch hog.

Thats some funny chit right there I don't care who you are !
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q307/TexasHogDogs/0ROFLMAO1-1.gif)

Its like this some hogs are just not going to bay up very easy using open , silent , semi open are a pure open bawling dog with a monkey riding on his back blowing the hell out of a bugle  and then there are some that will crap there hog britches and shut down right on the spot .  We have stopped big bad 275+ boars with three inch 30/30's hangin out their mouth that you know is bad to the bone in just a few mins and wonder how in the hell that happened and then again we have ran 190+ boars with no tusk hardly for three four hours and get them and then again sometimes never get them .  Some boars big, med are small just won't bay up .  Its all about the hogs in that department.
 
Silent are Open is just a matter of opinion, choice are desire  of each hunter.

Thats my opinion.  I myself don't like open mouth dogs don't like all the rackett but one that  yips are chirps here and there I like it lets me know what is going on and which direction I need to be headed.  Hard hunted hogs you dont think are going to run soon as they hear that pickup drive into the land?  Soon as the four wheeler cranks up you dont think hard hunted hogs are gonna run?  Soon as they smell man are dog you dont think they are going to run and I bet half of them are more can smell ya before they ever hear ya.

There is just as many open dogs out there that catch and stop just as many hogs as a silent are semi silent dogs and again it just all boils down to what the man wants and likes.

There used to be a guy in DeLeon named Larry Neighbors that had some jam up Plotts. Not sure what line they were but he was a coonhunter.

Hey!  I've seen it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsHgpS2lug8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsHgpS2lug8)

I have some of Mike's Bayou Cajun stuff via Trey Love, his hunting partner.  Those two catch some big bad Russians all the time.  I have a bitch with Bayou Cajun top and bottom.  And a big male with Bayou Cajun in him.  Mike used to live across the street from me before I moved to Alaska the second time,about 15 years ago.  Back then he was traveling all over the US to find the best big game plotts.  He brought back blood from Joe Husdson's Timex dog and others, such as (maybe)Crockett, but has bred out the Crockett like catch stuff, does not want the vet bills anymore.  Mike posted on the Parker Cur site that what he has now is Shamrock, Weems and Swampland melded into his Bayou Cajun lines.   He also lays high praise on other plott lines.  Mike is my age, mid-fifties, and always could and still can run off and leave me in the woods.  Trey and Mike have both sold their stock to Norway and Yugoslavia hunters.  Here is a pic of Mike's stuff and what him and Trey do nearly every weekend:

(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/spillway_boar1.jpg)

I also have a black female that keeps my chin greasy from all the pork she finds from the Beaucoup lines.  Turning into a top dog. Semi-open and runs silent a lot.  She has some Alabama Hammer and Sizzlin Heat in her.  She is nearly the same stuff Jim Crainer had at one time and used in his cur-crosses.  In the photo she is with her litter sisters, both "blue" plotts.  Her mother and grandfather (Orval Robert's Jeb) were blue plotts from the Beaucoup lines.  She and here sisters are much faster running dogs, as they are 35-40 pounders, than the Bayou Cajun lines, and they are much less grittier.   My big male from Bayou Cajun will go toe-to-toe and get knocked down by a hog, then get right back up and go again.  The Beaucoup females I have are not anything like him.  I don't breed plotts, so go see Orval Roberts in Kelley, LA or Mike Cauley or Trey Love in Folsom, LA as they occasionally have spare pups, but rarely.

The last thing below is a video of the blue plott pups and their sisters at 11 weeks age with the first hog they have seen.



(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/alldogs353lbboar2.jpg)

(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/Newyearhog_034b.jpg)

(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/adan_staronbox.jpg)

(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/th_orvalplotts11wks.jpg) (http://s259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/?action=view&current=orvalplotts11wks.flv)

Yeah that's it. Said they were real bad about fighting, and all they did was catch though.

Cascade sounds right.  I took a bear hunter from Washington state hog hunting with my curs when I lived in California.  He said my main cur hunted wider than his plotts!  He had this strain. od cascade dogs  But his dogs tore up the bears, he had a mess of photos.  They were very good bear dogs.

Ha,Ha....Awesome.

TexasHogDog (Jim)

Here are my two line of plotts for contrast.  On the left is a Bayou Cajun male (red brindle) pup and on the right is a grown female Beaucoup line (black w/brindle points).  Big difference in the way they hunt.  The only thing they have in common is bottom and extreme prey drive.

Glad to "meet" you and see your male plott.  He is sort of like Viagra, I don't think I will need it right now, but it is nice to know its there!  :D


Bud


(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh281/BGOATCHER/plottszignbuster.jpg)

Yeah you can really tell the difference on those two lines of dogs.  You can sure tell that female is family related to my male they look a lot alike.  It sure was nice talking to you and if you need to use this  male just let me know he is a pretty good bred little fellow most important he has been finding hogs since 10 months old and has never stopped also quiet on track only barking when he is looking at the hog and is a med distance  hunter a real looping dog only getting real rangey when he is on a runner they have trouible stopping he won't quit lots of game lots of drive and hunt.  You can come hunt with him if you like.

 Stay in touch.

THD

15 Months old in pic.
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q307/TexasHogDogs/jimcory013-1.jpg)


His pups at 6 Months old
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q307/TexasHogDogs/youngdogs053.jpg)

(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q307/TexasHogDogs/youngdogs054.jpg)

This was a good thread on dogs.  I know its almost a year old, but just signed up on the page and was using the search and it popped up..

I think the original post was asking about pocahantas plotts. 

I only owned 1.  He was a night champion coon dog and needed if my memory serves me right, 1 more win and would be a grand night champion coon dog.

I had been on a coon dog message board I think it was  at coon hound central.  Keep in mind, I never was much count as a coon hunter, just wasnt exciting enough for me.  But, I found a nitch.  Them coon  and bear hunters are bad to pull out the 22 remington if a sure nuff coon hound does two things  1. is on a hunt and runs across a hog track and likes hogs more than coons if suppose to be a coon dog or 2. if they ran quiet.  A coon hunter has to hear his dog to make a call on a coon contest... no bark, no call, no points....and bear hunters, they love to hear that dogs voice.  No voice, no likey..

I got several dogs over the years from the above when one of the two happened..  The coon hunters would usually give you the dog, but, without papers just to save the bullet... the bear hunters, they didnt have many give me's, but would sell'm quick and cheap compared to what they had paid for the dog in the first place.

Well, this is how I got the pocohontas male dog I had.   Talked to the fella on a message board the night he came in from the hunt.. He was mad as a hornet at the dog....   got on a hog and wouldnt get off, had to follow his dang tracking collar all night and was imbarrased as heck infront of the other coon hunters....

I had to drive all the way from Danbury Texas to Bentonville arkansas that weekend to get him, but, other than gas and food along the way, He didnt cost me a dime.

Took him hog hunting the following weekend, he never barked a time until he was looking at the hog.   Never once ran a coon when I owned him... A gator finally got him as he was after a hog in a slew...  He was a natural hog dog and ran quite for me on hogs, but, I ran him mostly by himself or another dog that ran quiet also.  I wasnt much for turning a mess of dogs loose at one time..  But, some folks like that type of huntin.  Theres no right or wrong way if a hog is at the end of the bark...  :)   

A hound will run game naturally if he's/she's got any heart at all, you just have to find the game he wants to run the most...  If its a hog, man, hold on to that dog...  but if it likes coons more, let a coon hunter have it and find you another..

Just my opinon,

Hog

I agree with you hog,....that's how I came by my best dog right now,....she's a cur/fiest cross that started yipping on a really hot hog track and that was it....the guy that owned her was done with her. I traded another dog for her and a little boot. Since I mostly hunt with guys that have hounds that are open on track it made no difference to me if she yipped a little bit on track. She's a heck of a hog finding dog and I'm very happy with her. Good luck on your next hunt.

Ive got a pochahontas hammer breed plott male (open). Hunts his arss off. Just bred him to a solid florida cur bitch.

We have a plott from Orval Roberts.  He is twelve years old, but he is still our main strike dog.  Not real fast, but has more nose than anything I've ever hunted with.  The thing that really sets him apart is heart.  This past year on one hunt, he started the hog then we turned four two year olds to him.  An hour later we made a road crossing, the young dogs crossed 15 minutes before he did.  Five hours later, the old dog had the hog bayed by himself while the young dogs were in the box, having been picked up along the way.

I have a two year old from White Deer Kennel that is making a nice dog.

Both of these dogs are open on track.  My Dad uses silent BMC's, but I think I bay as many as he does.  When he can't start a track, he will tell me, "Go ahead and put one of those loud-mouthed SOB's on it and see what they can do".  LOL

hear is my plott out of bear and cat dogs best hog dog i can find my dad raise hem from a pup     (http://i810.photobucket.com/albums/zz25/kingdog79/Picture220093-1.jpg)  some hogs we got with him (http://i810.photobucket.com/albums/zz25/kingdog79/748594771207_0_BG-1.jpg)(http://i810.photobucket.com/albums/zz25/kingdog79/727678902207_0_BG-1.jpg)(http://i810.photobucket.com/albums/zz25/kingdog79/136023310207_0_ALB-1.jpg)