EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

I just had a deal where the dog started later than the others was very inconsistent and one minute he showed signs of makng it and other times it was like he didn't know why I brought him. Gave him to a friend and  3 months later he is making a dog he's about 15 months old now he was a year when I culled him.First time for this but now I'm really second geussing myself when I think about culling. Des

Hey des when u have pups that r coming on strong like urs I think u can do that and just be pumped that he did turn on but its better to know for sure then to waste time n may or may not

I've told this story a hundred times Des, but the best dog I own at one year old wouldn't even look in the direction of a hog.  No BS, but she would follow us to a bay and lay down about 20 yards away and really not even then would she pay a lot of attention to what was going on.  It seemed like a silly reason at the time, but I kept her around only because she was the prettiest looking yellow brindle dog I had ever layed eyes on.  I just couldn't bring myself to get rid of her even though some of my relatives who had heard of my frustration with her were begging to have her for a pet.  When she figured out the game, she came on like blazes. 

I would probably sell all five of my other strike dogs for one more just like her, and I'm not sure money could buy this gyp.  She's right at two years old now, and what excites me even more is that I believe with her young age she has potential to be even better than she is today.  The bad side to all this is that I bought her as a pup for $100 off a guys chain not knowing anything about her, and still having since tried I know nothing about her lineage. 

I have a young dog that comes from good bloodlines.  Got him when he was about 14 months old.  But he had been put up in the kennel and never messed with the whole time before I got him, and was wild as a coyote and very ignorant.  I put some handlin on him and he showed some progress for a while, then it was like he hit a brick wall and all progress quit and he even went backwards a bit.  but I kept him around because the way I see it he has to spend some time in his second year learning what he should have learned in his first year.  Physically he is a dog but mentally he is still a puppy.  He's starting to be much more consistant now and I like the way he works.  The last month i've hunted 4 times and he's hung with the big dogs, and he likes to hunt and I figgure he will start striking hogs once he figgures it out a little more.  It would have been easy to get rid of him those first few months, being he was a grown dog and would stand right next to you with a scared coyote look on his face when the other dogs were baying 30 yards away.  But really he is a 18 month old dog but has only lived and learned something besides how to eat and poop for about 4 months while I've had him.

Waylon

I start all my dogs the same and most of the time they are hunting at the age of 5 to 6 months but this dog did not, really different.I mean would leave stay gone sometimes be at a bay and other times go back to the truck or lay down by us. He came close to getting a bad case of lead poisoning i mean close.But the guy who has him is tickled to death and wants some more that I don't think will make it even kinda picking at me. Its all good though. Thanks for the input Des.I got some dove hunters this morning so I got to go to work man this is rough.

Hey guys sorry, Im just trying to disect some of the parts of the story here, still learning the "ling-o" anyway what does "culling" mean?

to cull a dog means to get rid of him because you dont think hes going to make anything worth feeding.

Oh ok good to know that term is thrown around often... THANKS

Des, one to two years old is what I go by. Any dog under a year old is just an immature puppy.

Yes, there are dogs that start early. I've seen way too many dogs culled, ruined and even killed on hogs because their owners pushed to hard and expected to much from them.

I don't even start a young dog in the woods anymore until they are a year old. Let them be a puppy the first year. Get a handle on them, socialize them, show them what a hog is... then haul them to the woods with the older dogs.

100% agree with mike, ive seen it a few time myself. im about to start taking a few catahoula pups that are around a year that didnt show interest at first but ill let you know how they do in the woods this weekend.

the first dog we got was like that,, he wouldnt show any interest in a hog, we would walk into a bay and he would just stand beside us... most people wouldve culled him but he was the only dog we had so we had nothing to lose,, at about a year old he all the sudden out of no where found a hog,, man was i suprised,, then we just kept huntin him and he got better and better,, but i think its just how many dogs your tryin to get started at one time

I can only relate this to horses.....

It seems like the ones that are the most trouble turn out the best. The tougher ones to halter break, the ones that seem not to "get it", and the ones that are just late bloomers all seem to me to be worth the wait. I've had plenty of the ones that were tougher to deal with turn into superstars. By the same token, it has been my experience that some of the horses that turn on early in life tend to get bored and loose their luster and zest for the show ring. They showed such promise as youngsters, but have since just gone flat. I can't be sure, but it would seem logical that dogs could be the same way.

Wax on, Wax off.
M

Thanks for the input I guess its that age old question which is realitive to any question. I personally like naturals in horses and in dogs this just took me for a loop.I still have not seen the dog hunt but I trust this guys judgement it has me stumped. I will learn from this to look a little closer. The ones I pick or start early and they just improve I like to see a glimpse at what I breed it to do early. Thats why must horse people have a training scale to keep the over achivers going and hammer on the nuckle heads same with dogs my hot ones hunt with the big dogs a little and the other ones are getting schooled with a pig in a class room setting.I just spoke to a long time breeder about this he says some breeds start later than others in his experience I'm not going to mention what breed. I'm not starting that but he says in some breeds it takes a little longer. I didn't breed this dog but he came from a good strain my loss I guess, the guy said I can still breed to him as he laughs I'm happy for him. Thanks again Des

Des, catahoulas start late... that's why I never give up on one until it's at least two years old. Now in that two years it has to show some signs... but I don't expect it to burn the woods up. But that's my breed of choice that i've been around all my life.

...but when the light turns on, it never turns off! ;D

This dog is 3/4 cat Mike I thank you for that. Thats what I was told about that breed by a cat breeder and a lep cur breeder. I have had dogs out of most of the main breeders around from Cats and even a  real Fox hound, also Kemmers off of Robert Kemmers yard. I have been bear hunting cat hunting with dogs as well so I have a idea what i like. I have been hog hunting for only 5yrs but I have had  61 dogs and 9 different breeds so I have been through a  few.I love the naturals and early starters they just are easier for me to feed but if you know what you are getting into it should be fine.Mike you know those dogs so I know you got it can't wait to see your new pup go. Good luck Des

Des, i've learned to be a lot more patient with dogs the past few years. I had quite a few come through my yard over the years that I gave up on way too early... some I wish I could go back in time and get back. ;D

I still learn something new all the time... just like to share what i've experienced with others.

I think there is a lot of truth to the old adage of "Good things come to those who wait" and also that "Patience is a virtue".  Sometimes I just find myself a little too impatient and overly eager to see the fruit of my labor!

I think yalls ideas are great. Like I said if I would have researched a little more I might have  held on longer. The window for labs pointers are about the same if that 5 month old lab is not showing any sign of retreiving he won't last long with them as well. Even furturity horses its by date of birth by my short hog dogging the  ones who starts baying cows and horses are those dogs that cross water don't lost bark  will be sick about there job. I mean lots of stay power and adapts to hunting easier to me. I breed a litter of pups for myself every year by the time there 6 monthes old they are like the pup I took to E C as well as Penny. Young but know and love there jobs but also I can go to the source that have been breeding these dogs so they know all about them.Also I think females a serious about it earlier all about business in the lines of dogs I'm breeding. For myself a man has to know his limitations I mean this about myself I better stick to dogs I think I know. Before I mess up some elses good line  of dogs. Des

I couldn't agree more mike ,I don't like starting a dog before its at least 10 -12 months old ,but once started I never leave them at home & get as many pigs into them as I can while they are still young.

I  have my pups loose they learn to be socialized  by the older dogs on chains or in the pens I can walk my pups in the woods so if they hunt thats what they do you don't have to push them they just take off thats genetics. Mike is useing a catch dog pup now thats a puppy to catch and she maybe a year or so. So if your pup starts baying you discourge it or do you pet it and say good dog.You can't make any animal or even person do anything they don't want to. I don't get a little pup 2 to 4 monthes old and put it down and leave it  I'm talking about a pup that everytime you take it some where its baying staying gone hunting those pups I take. I know of a breeder that has lost 5 month old pups because at home they pull out and go a mile or so. Mike also said Cats start late so thats one reason he has to wait.Its to each his own but the naturals you don't have to push have been my best dogs so far. And as far as immature If you have one pup with grown dogs he has know one to play with so he learns from the old dogs to go not play. I think if you start your dogs with rough dogs he might be a little rough if you start your dogs with stand back bay dogs I think he will do that so its up to the owner to put them with dogs he wants him to be like like your kid looks up to his parents.Des