EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

First things first...First, .I dont live in an area where there is a very high hog pupulation.  I may have to drive for an hour or so before I find a good hog track.  Second, I have more plotts than curs and I would consider myself a plottman before I would consider myself a cur man.  Third, I've hunted all over the eastern US with some really good plott guys (much more knowledgable than me).

Coming from a plott guy....plotts are bread to be relativeley cold nosed hounds with A LOT of grit and A LOT of stick (aka bottom).  They are not the fastest hound and they are not known for thier mouth.  They are a rough breed of hound and runs to catch.

I've read a couple of post lately about plotts.  One was about thier mouth and one was about them not being too rough.  I guess what I am saying is, if you are not breeding or trying to get plotts that are rough and bred to catch, you are not getting a good plott..in my mind.  I dont care what a plott sounds like or what they look like...they had better hunt and they better be set on catching a hog.  If I wanted fast, I would get a Walker.  If I wanted a mouth I would get a Bluetick.  If I wanted cold nose I would go with a Black and Tan or Redbone.  But, I want a dog that can do most of above and at the end of the trail, I want them to put thier mouth on the hog and catch him.

Every bloodline, is going to have some positives and negatives.  But if you are not a plott guy and you are trying to breed or find a plott that is not rough and you are looking for a plott with speed or mouth, maybe you should consider looking at another hound or a hound cross.

Since this is a mostly cur dog site, I am sure there will be a bunch of curdog men that disagree, but if you were a plottman, you would know what i am saying and you would agree. 

In my opinion, if a plott doesn't try to catch, he is a cull.  He or she doesnt have to catch, but he better try to catch or he better have a moth full of hog hair when I get there! 

a good friend of mine has a plott/cur cross.  Jam up dog, mostly closed, but opens on a hot hot track.  He is plenty rough.  A damn good dog to hunt behind.

Ive got my main strike dog penned up with a plott thats coming in,she is real cold nosed ,closed mouth,she has been striking hogs 4 my buddy hoping to get some good pups out of them,neither one is gritty though

Thanks for the opinion "Lord of the Plott". Thanks for grouping some of us that want to hear there plott dogs with those that don't want a gritty plott. I agree somewhat with your ALL KNOWING way of thinking. I don't care what breed of dog it is if I'm hunting it for hogs I want it to put teeth in them if they break bay or to shut them down and make them bay. "I don't want any hound that catches its prey. What would be the fun in that?"If I wanted something just to catch hogs with a poor mouth I would go by the local pound and pick up a pair of pittbulls and drop them on hogs. I want one that will run its game till it can stop it and make it bay or untill its heart stops beating. but since I'm a simple DOGMAN and not a bonified PLOTTMAN what do I know.

Most plotts I have owned and hunted with, know how to apply just enough pressure to keep an animal bayed, they know better than being suicidal or "too gritty" that they add so much pressure that the animal will not bay and keep running and rarely will you get a hound that is a coward and the animal will let keep running because the dog will not stop it.

Orval Roberts is a Plottman and it's been stated in other post that he breeds for speed but not for grit, so I don't think he would agree with you.  I'm not saying you're wrong about your opinion on what a good Plott is, but I don't think it's any of your concern on what another mans preference is regarding HIS Plott dogs.

WOW!!!! :o so......what line do you run?

Plott hound r great dogs

DRStuart..I was just giving my opinion...never stated I was a know it all.   I bet you have opened your trap on here before and gave your opinion....did anyone bash you back?  I am just saying that if your into plotts just for thier mouth...u in it for the wrong reason.  But you let all of your stupididty out when you said ""I don't want any hound that catches its prey. What would be the fun in that?"...What the heck kind of comment is that?  You wearing a skirt?  Thats becuase you aint a hound guy and you obviously dont have a dang clue what u are talkn about.  I've never met a hog hunter that did't want his hound to catch prey....you just want to look at the prey???  Plotts were bred to catch game.  There are a lot of people out there watering down the breed that was meant to catch.  Dont come on here and call me a hound god for giving my opinion and try to embarass me....

Mason, Orval is a Plottman...much more that I for sure.  I dont own Orvals dogs becuase I think there are hunters that have exactly what I am looking for.  I need a pack with grit (not neccessarily suicidal), but I want a plott that is rough, that is how they were bred and brought to the US.  It is my concern when I see guys out there breeding plotts for mouth and not for grit....it's my concern becuase they are watering down the breed.

TNHILL...I have CAJUN plotts, one from Mr. Burkett, and a pup from Jason Brickford.  My Cajun plotts and my Burkett plott all have decent speed, good noses, medium size, will to hunt, and want to catch.

I know someone who ran lots of plotts in his younger days and he caught lots of hogs and he said the best plotts for him were Orval Roberts bred...

I believe its all in what the hunter wants just because everyone doesnt like the dog the way you do doesnt make it wrong or not a good plott dog. I have 2 silent plotts neither dog is gritty and i would not want them to be. Ive spoke to orval a few times about dogs and in my eyes i think id take what he is doing over your thoughts no disrespect but if its ok with him pretty sure most would be ok with it lmao

Is that Mr. Burkett from  Lydia  Tx

EastTXoutlaw..You are right, everyone has an opinion and they have what works for them.  My opinion, which I have a right to, is posted in my first post.  There are others besides Mr Roberts that have been at this a while too...I know plenty of them that will take grit over speed. Including me...

I'm not trying tp push my opinion on anybody, I am just stating my opinion.  People can agree or disagree.

Black hog 69, I believe so, the dog is out of White Deer Preserve.  I actually bough the dog from a guy on here (TomTom).  Brought him home and put him in a pen at 8 months old.  He ran right up to the hog and tried catching him on the face.  The hog slung him down and beat up on the dog for a second and then he ran.  The 8 month old pup got right up and ran after the hog.  The hog stopped and bayed, pup tried catching again, when the hog broke and ran and pup grabbed his nuts and made him turn around.  He then went to baying.  that was the first and last time in the bay pen.  I put him opn 10-12 hogs in the woods since then, and he ran ran or bayed everyone one of them since.  He is 11 months old, full of grit and bottom.  Very good mouth, medium speed....but he is only 11 months.

  well i ain't gettin in this one  :o  i've only been runnin behind hounds for 50 years . what would i know ?  exceptin i really don't want my hounds and plott curs tryin to catch a hog when i'm not close enough to get to um quickly . or my walkers or my cross dogs or my full curs . some do yeah but they don't last long round here . breed and hunt what suits ya .

Thats the way I feel about it also halfbreed,dont want my find dog trying to catch I got other help dogs 4 that plus a bulldoggggg!!

Correct

;D   im trying, so far, so good.  :angel:

LMAO

 I want my good dogs to stand back and bay, I dont mind them stopping a runner but then I want them to get back. I've got to much time invested in them and good strike dogs are too hard to replace.

First of all I have never opened my mouth on here and gotten bashed. Secondly I was raised to think before you speak. I never said I was into plotts for thier mouth. I simply was asking what lines had better mouths when you decided to call me out on that. You Sir have embarassed yourself by stating if your breeding for mouth your watering down the breed. LMAO. I hope that was a joke because any breeder worth his salt will tell you that breeding for certain traits doesn't mean you have to let any other quality traits go. You simply have to line breed and cull hard. Again I stand behind my statement of not wanting my hounds to catch there prey. If you actually had a clue you would know that Hounds were bred for there Locating and Tracking ability. I'm gonna take the skirt comment as a reference to my Scottish Heritage. You once again are mistaken by claiming I don't have a clue and am not a hound guy. I sir am 31 years old and have been hunting behind some of the best Walker and English Coonhounds in Arkansas since I was 5 years old. So do the math plottman I'am a HOUNDMAN, and you don't have a clue. You need to reread the history of the Plott dog I don't recall anywhere stating they were bred to catch game. On that tip you need to read a couple dog breeding and genetic books before you continue to open mouth and insert foot. I believe most real Plottmen on this site or any other would disagree with your Idea of a good Plott. Don't believe the majority of your big game plott guys want there valuable strike and bay dogs catching there game ie. Mountain lion, Bear, and Boar. I have a suspision most want there dogs to apply enough pressure to get the job done no more and not an ounce less. And yes sir I want to just look at my prey until I send a catchdog or a bullet. Hunt what you like...Denny

Denny,

Yep I am convinced you have no clue.  You might know about hounds, but you dont know an dang thing about plotts.  It is ignorance like yours that has plotts out there that dont need to be out there.  Plotts were never bred specifically for mouth and if there is any trait that the plott is weak on it is the mouth.  Most plotts have a medium type chop mouth, not overly loud.  And if you are looking for a plott lines with good mouths,,,Im sure you wont find a line that has a great mouth....that is not a strong trait or strongly desired trait amoung plott hunters/breeders.  You will not find a plott breeder or serious plott hunter that breeds for the mouth.  So why you are laughing about my comment of breeding for mouth waters down a bloodline...keep laughing; I'm not embarrased at all.   Any ol'hound can track and trail; good plotts get rough fast and they stop hogs.  It is obviuos you've been hunting behind Walkers and English dogs, becuase if you had hunted behind good plotts, you would know that they are rough and a good pack of rough plotts will make a hog stop fast and if he tries to break, they will catch him and not let him break again.

You don't think plotts are and were bred to catch game??  Obviously they are not catchdogs, but they were and are bred to bring game to bay and keep them at bay or tree.  Plotts dont keep hogs at bay without getting rough and putting teeth on them.  You have got to be kidding me......I am starting to wonder why I have spent so much time on replying to your ignorant comments. 

Denny,

I noticed by reading one of your other posts that you've been hog hunting for a year now...(since last Feb).  I've been hog hunting using plotts for the last 8 years.  I know you've read a lot of books...maybe that is why your are such as "Houndsman".  How about this...spend some more time in the woods behind a pack of plotts and then you can join the discussion of a good plott. LMAO, LMAO, LMAO

You sir have expressed your ignorance more than I could ever exagerate. YOU have expressed that your dogs catch there game. I didn't make that up. Of course any dog that you can successfully hunt on hogs is gonna put teeth in them when they break or to shut them and make them bay that goes without saying.NO DOG KEEPS A BIG BOAR AT BAY WITHOUT PUTTING TEETH IN THEM. A good pack of junkyard dogs will put teeth in them and make them bay. I never said I was looking for Plotts with big horn mouths. Like any breed out there I assumed there might be some out there with better mouths than others. You took it upon yourself to call me out like I had asked the most bizzare question when I asked about mouth on plotts. And once again you should be embarressed by stating that breeding for mouth waters down bloodlines. That has to be the dumbest statement I have read on here and I've read some ignorant things. Of course if I wanted big mouth hog dogs I would hunt other breeds. Why you have chosen to take a stand on this is beyond me. I've hunted behind English redticks that would make you cry when it comes to grit and putting teeth on a hog. Why don't you do everyone on this board a favor and keep your uneducated opinions to yourself.OR spend a couple decades hunting and breeding dogs and then holla back. I'm done with this...

I guess you saw the hog's I'm producing then.

LMAO

I've caught or killed a total of 37 hogs in the last 12 months with my culls in a part of the country thats not over run with hogs. So for my first 12 months at chasing pigs I don't think thats to bad. How many hogs did you bay up with just your dogs the first year you hog hunted........

I respect the fact you have been hunting behind plotts for 8 years, and I'm not on here to argue over opinions. I've made comments I shouldn't have and feel that before we keep face barking that maybe we should agree to disagree?.....Denny

every dog that someone says  is bred to "run to catch" is just that. Most of us want to catch game and not just hear dogs running and barking. I know I do. I love plotts and when I was in michigan I had a bunch of run to catch plotts. Just like hogs if your hound bites a bear in back axle and gets him to turn he is "catching the game" at that point he better get back and bark or he will be dead.  Its a simple fact that a bear is bigger and stronger than my dogs and if he trys to fight head to head he will be dead. I never had trouble culling those dogs as they do it all by them selfs. I want my cur dogs that I have now to do just what my hounds did on bear. Stop them from running. get them to turn and fight, and then get back and tell me where to get so I can do my part. A smart cur dog will apply just enough preasure to make a hog fight and then wait on the calvary. I know a lot of you run rough curs that catch hogs. you probably catch a lot to. however everyone hunts a little different even dogs of the same breed. Ive seen everything in plotts from a super gritty pit like dog to a stand 30 foot away and squal type and they were both registered plotts and both treed bears. I think some of you guys are getting your feelings hurt a little too much. We're all in this together boys. respect the other guys opinion and go on. Peta loves to see us argue cause it shows a lack of unity.

yup.

I agree about the unity!!! But you can only put up with so much bashing. The guy who posted this pretty much said anyone that is breeding or has plotts that arent super gritty are junk. I beg to differ. But he pretty much directly insulted any plott owner that doesnt have gritty dogs. It would be better to just not post things like this because all it turns into is an argument. I have hunted behind plotts for 12 years that doesnt make me a hound expert and i dont pretend to be everyone can learn new things from others all the time.

there isn't a hog dog alive that doesn't put "some" teeth on a hog to stop it. why else would they stop? When it comes to bears ive seen dogs that wouldnt touch the bear for nothing. but that bear would just stay 50 to 80 yards in front of the dogs and the guys with those dogs would sneak ahead and kill it. Not my style, but they still got there bear. I personally like to tree a bear take its picture and let it back out. They dont breed fast enough to kill many in my opinion. I guess you could do the same with hogs but i bet its a cluster. I personally catch hogs with bulldogs so i need my curs to find and "stop" a hog. I dont like it when they catch before i get there but it does happen sometimes. any way why dont you died in the wool cur dog guys start bashing plotts for being open mouthed and really get this thing heated.

Ive seen several dogs that have kept plenty of big boars bayed, no teeth required...  ;)


Yes there is...  ;)

LMAO!
(http://serc.carleton.edu/images/introgeo/quantskills/popcorn.gif)

Trent didn't tell you??? He just yells "here piggy piggy piggy" and they just stop and wait for him to get there...  ;) LOL!

Sounds like he must be a "Hog Whisperer." I've heard the ol'timers speak of such men.....LOL

I never said it was MY dogs!!  ;)  ;D

However, i do have a bmc that has found and bayed quite a few good boars by herself, and i think one of the main reasons they stay bayed for as long as she was on some of them is because she puts NO pressure on them to make them run... Very loose baying..
Ive only seen her put teeth on a handful of hogs, and most of them were in the water ( she tends to get brave in water for some reason )

Bottom comes into play on the runners or a hog that breaks bay...  
Could she stop more hogs by putting teeth on them?  Possibly..
Does she still find and bay hogs consistently? YES

She is nothing special, and like you my pack is all young... She is my oldest dog and only 2 years old..
Ive been hunting long enough now that I should have a older, more experienced pack but i guess im too picky about my dogs..
Always looking for something better, and not enough patience to let the younger dogs mature...  :-\

Ive had several others that wouldn't hardly put teeth on a hog, but we still caught hogs consistently...   ;)

 :D  Nope, I train my dogs to be the " Hog Whisperers" ...

They find the hogs, and just keep a conversation going with them till i can sneak in and catch them...
My dogs are pretty good about texting me about whats going on too...  ;)

LMAO! Texting... LMAO! That's great!!!  :laugh:

That is scary.  Remind me to stay clear of that phone of yours.   ;)

We hunt four dogs that wont put a single tooth on a hog. Just saying.

I never said it was MY dogs!!  ;)  ;D

However, i do have a bmc that has found and bayed quite a few good boars by herself, and i think one of the main reasons they stay bayed for as long as she was on some of them is because she puts NO pressure on them to make them run... Very loose baying..
Ive only seen her put teeth on a handful of hogs, and most of them were in the water ( she tends to get brave in water for some reason )

Bottom comes into play on the runners or a hog that breaks bay...  
Could she stop more hogs by putting teeth on them?  Possibly..
Does she still find and bay hogs consistently? YES

She is nothing special, and like you my pack is all young... She is my oldest dog and only 2 years old..
Ive been hunting long enough now that I should have a older, more experienced pack but i guess im too picky about my dogs..
Always looking for something better, and not enough patience to let the younger dogs mature...  :-\

Ive had several others that wouldn't hardly put teeth on a hog, but we still caught hogs consistently...   ;)


[/quote]
I see what your saying. Thats how my dogs bay for the most part. I agree 100% on dogs not putting to much pressure so they don't break bay. I don't favor extra gritty dogs. I've had more success behind dogs that just put teeth on them to stop them or if they break bay. Once they get the hog to set up and bay I like mine to back up and bay. That works for me best ,but to each his own.I know some boys that like em the grittier the better and they catch a bunch of hogs, but they also spend alot of time at the vet. I think its all a personal preference but I like not having to staple dogs after every hunt.  

Hilarious

Sounds like you need some gritty kungfu dogs! They can just put the cobra technique on em like in the karate kid movie... Lol! ;D

x2! Lmao!

 :P  ;D

Can't do that.  I need to hear my dogs.   ;)

 :oI'm pleading the fifth this go round. lol.

Duh, thats why you hunt a Catahoula or something with them or just listen for the squeal!!!  :)

I am actually breeding bulldogs to have a nice bark that carries 900 yards or better.  Nothing worse than a dog you can't hear in the woods.   ;)

long eared bulldogs?

Let me know when they are ready!! A bulldog with a loud mouth would be worth the drive over!!!!  ;)

No, I breed for "gator moufs", and the ears would just get in the way.   >:D

I would offer to send pics of the parent stock breeding, but I'm afraid I would be linked in to the investigation that is currently being conducted on you by the internet police.   popo

You sicko!!!!!!  ;D   >:D

F da popo  !!

x2

A good plott..I don't hunt plotts but have seen a few. I hunted mtn curs that looked like plotts...but to me a good plott is gritty enough to put teeth on a hog if it breaks and does what it can to stop it...if the hog is bayed he will back off and bay 6 or 10 feet from the hog... two plotts won't get t0o gritty if the hog is stopped... three or more plotts and they will put pressure on the hog and make him back up against a log or bank or possible make the hog break bay... five dogs and they will catch and release as they get tired and rested...but the hog won't be able to run if the terrain is open enough to let the dogs work how they want...The dogs will be cautious and smart enough to stay clear of the tusks...there are some occasions when the dogs throw caution to the wind and it is at these times when a dog of this type can get crippled or killed...but these dogs have stick and will stay as long as needed until the hog is brought to bay...

does anybody know how to get in touch with mike caludy with the cajun plotts