EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

Anyone ever dealt with a dog that gets a little possesive over a caught or killed hog?  I just noticed this for the first time Sunday morning on a gyp I've been hunting real hard for about a year.

yep, i've seen it.lol. mike's dog though so i'll let him tell ya about it...

We have hunted with a few like that. Seems they think if they strike the hog, they own the hog.  ;D  Who am I to fault them, they did find the hog 8)
One gyp we hunt with will camp out over the hog, and growl at any other dog that comes up. It has not caused any real problems that I am aware of, other than a bit of an annoyance at times. Some people might be bothered by it, but I am not one of them

Yep, i've seen a bunch of dogs like this. My Blue dog is bad about it... he tries to jump on any dog that comes around the hog after it's tied or dead.

I have several like that, and I don't mind it a bit. Those dogs are the ones that never quit IMO. They want to controll the hog live or dead. I like to see a young dog standing on top of a dead hog, claiming it.

I have seen it and I dont tollerate it.  Once a hog is down I expect my bay dogs to not bother it again. 

I don't want a dog messing with a caught hog, but I don't mind one camping out next to the caught hog, and being possessive.   I see those as two different things myself.

I think he is referring to dogs jumping other dogs near the hog after the hog is cought and tied. Maybe you are referring to this also it just seemed like it was being taken as the dog being aggressive with the hog after it was cought.

Matt G      

I have found one of the hardest things to teach my dogs to do is to leave once a hog is caught or killed and go back to hunting.  I have most of the young ones where I can lead them out about 20 yards and send them on and they won't go back, but sometimes during all the commotion of trying to tie it would be nice if the dogs would roll back out and get out of the way.  What has been beneficial to me is pulling a caught hog around in the buggy behind my four wheeler.  When a dog comes in and wants to go back there and bark I will catch him/her and lead them back out saying "caught hog".  They rarely bark at one in the trailer anymore and I would think the same would apply in the woods.

After thinking this over, maybe I should just let her be and it might act as a little more reason for the other dogs to get back out hunting.

As a sidenote, I have noticed that the rougher dogs are usually the ones that are harder to get back out.

Circle C,  sorry for the confusion, that didnt come out quite rite. LOL 

I was reffering to dogs hanging around to guard a caught hog and being agressive towards other dogs.

My "Pistol" dog will get real posessive over a hog when he has run it a long way by himself but hes not too bad if theres other hogs around because he will roll on and find another one. I dont like the possesiveness around young dogs.

Being possive , growling, which sometimes lead to fighting over a dead hog , tied hog or gut pile is not part of my training program. I cant stand it & I will get on a dog in a heartbeat for doing it.There is a lot of things that could happen if you allow this kind of behavier to take place in your pack.There is no advantage at all in letting your dog do this.

Don't get me wrong, my dog does it... but he gets "disciplined" from me when it happens. It's just something that i've never been able to break him from... and he ain't no cull! ;)

He's pushing 7 years old and if we were in a group of hogs he'll usually roll on another one... but sometimes he "owns" the caught hog.

Thanks for the comments.  I was just kidding on the let her be comment.  I don't tolerate any of my dogs being grouchy towards each other, but on the other hand I am very cautious on how I discipline them around a hog.  I want my point to be well understood.

I KNOW SOME PEOPLE THAT FEED THE HEART , LIVER AND KYDNEYS TO THE DOGS AS A REWARD. TO ME THATS JUST ASKING FOR A FIGHT. I WONT LET MY DOGS AROUND A GUT PILE.

I don't like that stuff either. When the hog is dead and I say "dead hog load up" the dog better be moving to the Mule if they want a ride home. Ain't got time... ;D

That one of those deals that it probably doesn't hurt any thing but is a bad habbit, especially when there are young dogs around. I like every thing to be easy going... don't chase dogs to get them to load up, won't seperate dogs because the don't get along, or any of that other stuff. They either get with the program or move on down the road (no matter how good they are).

Bryant, I think that is a VERY wise statement.  I think too many people get caught up in this "my dog better do what I want or else" type of mentality and end up missing the big picture.  Most dogs are going to associate correction with the activity that's going on at the time.... and **in my opinion** that makes correction at a hog pretty touchy.  As a general rule, I try to be extremely careful what I correct any dog for, when he is doing what I'm training him to do.  I'm not saying not to correct the dog, don't misunderstand me.  I'm just saying that folks need to be careful & and choose the time for that correction carefully.

You can MAKE a dog do nearly anything you want him to do, but if you choose the wrong time for correction, you can accidentally train him not to do the right things as well.  Did that make a lick of sense?

i'm no dog expert but i agree completely jlingle. i've seen that firsthand. i think it's very easy for a dog to misunderstand the reasons they are being disciplined if it's not made very clear to them. that's all i have, like i said- not a dog expert.lol.

Makes perfect sense and I agree 100%.

The same principal applies to cleaning up a dog off trash.  I personally use a shock collar but I will NOT shock a dog that I think is trashing in the woods, nor will I shock or scold a dog that comes in from hunting after I saw him run a deer 10 minutes ago (and for whatever reason couldn't shock him right then and there).  If you can catch them right in the middle of the act and very, very sternly make your point it usually doesn't take but about two times to get them right.  It's all about timing.

I will have to say I agree 100% Like to catch a dog in the act so he knows exactly what he is not suppose to do they are kinda like a young a toddler. If you don't catch them in the act then they they think they are getting in trouble for what they are doing at the moment. Make sense.

"Get out" is another command,  in the chain of command, and Dogs understand pecking order and a chain of command. I am the " Big Dog" and expect to be at the top of the pecking order, so when told to "get out" I am taking "possesion" of the hog., if they come back and growl or "try" it then they are challenging my possesion, which is the wrong answer. The dogs need to get out, and get ahead or, simply move away.

They all mess up and make challenges and there for need corrections. Keep it simple for them to understand, they are not nearly as complicated as people

I hunt alone most of the time, I also put alot of dogs on the ground. My dogs are use to running in a large pack wheather I am hunting Hogs or Cattle. There is a natural pecking order in any pack and the top dog is the leader and most likly to be possive of the hog. This is normal pack behavior and causes me no problems, when I call the top dog off the hog the rest will follow and roll out. I do not catch and lead my dogs out I might catch my lead dog and lead him out with the catch dog and ask the rest to follow. I try to use the natural pack pecking order to help me handle my dogs, I am the ALPHA and they know it.

I've been thinking a lot about this topic and decided to re-read my post and the responses.

Scott,  what I was refering to by using the term possesive is what your calling a "don't touch" type deal.  She would just nip...a quick burst and bark to run another dog off.  There was no actual fighting taking place.

Here's how the plot unfolded which led me to my original post.  My nephew and I were hunting one morning about a month and a half ago.  Dogs were out hunting as they should be and had been gone for a little while.  We were tracking behind them and easing down the creek/brush line.  From my tracking, I was pretty certain they were still moving ahead and so we weren't in a great big hurry moving behind them.  We stopped and were sitting talking and I decided to step in the woods to see how high the creek was flowing.  When I did, I suddenly could vaguely hear dogs.  I ran back to the four wheeler, told my nephew I was pretty certain we had a bay going and unloaded the catch dog.  We took off that way and when we got a little closer, they were indeed bayed solid.  I could hear squealing, and so I released the catch dog a pretty good ways out.  When we made it there as my luck usually goes they were in the water on the other side of the creek.  I decided to stay put and let my nephew continue down the bank looking for a good place to cross in case they came back across.  He was gone about 15 minutes looking before he came back and I ended up swimming.  I usually don't get to watch my dogs bay, catch and all that from that close for that period of time and so probably why I've never noticed Abby's behavior.  Every once in a while she would "burst" or growl other bay dogs off the hog.  (The catchdog was caught the entire time).  Each time, I would call her name and she would straighten up.  She did this about three different times.

Here's my thought on her.  In addition to wondering if anyone has ever seen this behavior (which several people have expressed they have), has anyone ever seen it from any dog other than the "pack leader" or "alpha" type dog.  I know beyond a doubt that this particular dog has turned her game ON since I started her last December and has found many hogs that were close and I heard her be the first to bark.  A lot of times my dogs are out of hearing range when they start a hog and so I don't know who actually struck first.  Could this perhaps be a behavior of her's when she strikes first, or do you guys think what she did would happen in all situations when she's on a bay?  It would tickle me to death if I thought she was starting a lot of these hogs she's been on.
 

Thanks for the clarification on that Bryant.  I have never ever seen a dog show aggresion towards another dog without the hog already cought by people.  Once legged and on the ground I have seen a few get pissy towards another dog but aggresion while the catch dog is cought dang well better be directed toward the hog in my opinion.  Even the dogs that showed a little aggresion after the hog was legged get tuned up pretty good, I would show special attention to one that showed attitude while all the dogs should be focusing their attention on controling the hog.

Matt

Good points, Scott.  I've never thought of the feeding / loading thing.  I just usually run down through the kennels from beginning to end.  I've been messing with hog dogs for a pretty fair amount of years, though my hunting styles and ideas have changed and evolved along the way.  Just goes to show, there's always something new to learn.  Thats what I really like about this board.

In the past. I have always believed that the true test of an up and coming dog is to take the single dog and dump them on the ground with a group of unfamiliar dogs.  When I do this what I'm watching for is not so much who strikes the hog first, but overall how the dog hunts.  That will usually let me know if my assumption is correct or if I'm wishing too hard.   ;)

With my dogs, I depend on the pack but I strive for independence.  I want each to be great.

I'm going to continue and watch the gyp.  Like I mentioned, the particular hunt happened in a way that I was able to stand and watch things for a while that I don't normally see.  Now I have to find out if indeed there is a problem and if so put a plan together to fix it.

Thanks for the input!

Its a bad habbit. Give the dog the boot... literally. Especially if you have young dogs, the last thing you want is a negative feedback when they do their job.