EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

I have a 18 week old pup (Ike).  he is my first hog dog and my pride and joy.  I just have to much on my plate and don't have the time or money to hunt him.  I have put countless hours of work into this dog.  He will be coming up for sale in the next two weeks.  I want to give him some woods experience before i sell.  He is baying like a two year old dog in the pen, and will catch on command.  I only have one dog so you can imagine how much time i have put into him.  Please let me know if your interested and a price will be determined when i see how he does in the woods.  he probably weighs close to 30 lbs already.  i have a friend that has video of it on a phone that i am trying to convert right now.   

(http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/martinsu25/GrazerBoarandIke.png)

(http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/martinsu25/NewPicture3.png)

I'm running a couple plott x bmc right now that I’m pretty happy with. I may be interested depending on the price and how far away you are. PM me when you find out what you want for him. Thanks

GIve me a call 210 260 5734

I might be interested, what is the price..

i will determine a price once i hunt him this weekend.  i paid 150 at 6 weeks, it will be at least that.  I don't want try and sell him until i see him work in the woods.  don't want to try and sell someone a dog that will only work in the pen and do nothing in the woods.  If he doesn't work or seem interested in the woods yet i will keep him and keep working him.  i just don't want to be known as selling a dog that isn't any good in the woods.  i want to have confidence that i am selling a worthy hunting dog.  If he were going to someone who just wanted to take him to bay pen contest i would sell him with no gaurantee that he will hunt in the woods.  I guess it will be from 200 up, or somewhere around there.  I will update his progress after his first woods hunt. 

A dog that will catch on command is worth a little money, es[ecially at only 18 weeks but i would have to see it first befor i buy. Where is the dog located? Thanks

30 minutes south of San Antonio.  if i could figure out how to send this video from a phone i can.  If you have an email address i can try it that way.  the video was from three week ago, and you can hear me command him to bite his ear and he does.  he has gotten better at listening to me by now, but is not 100% perfect yet. 

Thanks to everyone replies i will be keeping Ike.  Mike, or whoever can, you might want to move this to dogs on hogs discussion.  Once he is old enough to breed i will breed him to a full blood BMC gyp owned by Lawlershogwildhunts that is out of Dan Moody blood line.  please contact me or him if you are interested in a pup.  i would say we will be breeding mid next year.  You can buy as a pup or as a pen started pup.  once agian thanks to all comments and replies.  it helped a lot. 

He must of had hell of a night last night.  What did he do to go from selling him to becoming breeding quality?

 ;D I was informed i would be stupid to sell him, and the wife was there to hear it, so he is going no where.  im fairly new to this as far as owning my own dog, so i didn't realize what i had. 

So that makes him breeding quality?  I've got a couple of dogs I'll give you a great deal on if you'll buy this 6 carrot diamond for $300 from me.

I am very curious why my post got deleted? 

never said that made him breed quality.  i was asked by a couple of people if i would breed him to there gyps, so i am going from there.  no thanks on the ring or the dogs.

If you made the comment that once he is old enough to breed, which you did above, than, yes, you did state he was breeding quality.  To know this about a less than 6 month old pup from a cross breeding at that, you must have an eye.  Especially, since this is your first hog dog.  I wish you the best in all your future hunting endevours.

Regards,
Josh

i made that comment that i will breed him because some asked me to breed him.  I am not saying that every pup will be good enough to sell or worth anything.  the post is for those interested in a pup, so if your not i don't see any reason why you should comment negatively to the post.  if you don't think it's worth it then that is your opinion.  Ike is a working towards being a good hog dog.  it is my understanding that if people have something negative to say on a post it is not to be posted publicly, becuase that is means for getting removed.  does that only apply to certain people.

I think you may want to re-read my posts.  I have not commented in a negative manor at all.  I even stated you must have a good eye for prospects.  If you have been offended, you may have taken something from a different prospective.  Like I said, hope it all works out for you.  However, it seems like you're well on your way with a great prospect like that.

Bashing hapens from time to time on here, it shouldnt but it does! I agree with you, if you dont have anything nice to say then dont say anything at all. Some of the more experienced hog hunters should be able to tell from your comments that you are new to this and should take that into consideration. It is obvious that you are proud of your pup, good for you and your pup. The problem is your pup has a long way to go to be proven and while you are very optimistic about him the harsh reality is a very small percentage of these young dogs turn out to be anything worthy of being called a hog dog! Lets hope yours is the exception rather than the rule. I look forward to watching old IKE progress and hope he turns out to be the next big thing. Only time will tell.  Good luck

thank you Raider.  you said it better then i could.  you can tell from my comments that i wanted Ike to get woods work before anything, and that is becuase i know a dog can bay in a pen and do nothing when it's time to shine.  i am proud of what i have done with the pup, being my first one, and maybe a little too proud.  I have a lot to learn i guess.  i won't post anymore about Ike and just let it go. 

screw the negativity! Go Ike go!

Where is anyone bashing anyone?

There's always going to be topics that are questioned or critisized... but that's a long way from bashing.

To me bashing is calling someone names, telling them there dogs suck, trash talking, etc... Those folks get banned real quick.

Don't worry, I have an outstanding Internet Police Force on here that knows what is acceptable and doesn't let much get by. ;)

In defense of a new comer to the sport, I know where this dog came from and his blood line, I have a litter mate in my yard right now and know of 2 more from this litter all are working great and at thier age I can see where a young hunter would want to breed to them.
The other young man that has 2 of them is asking that already, cant say I blame them watching 4 of this blood line work.

This is not the first crossing of these two bloodlines but it is the last, the man that bred these dogs is getting out of cur dogs after some 20 yrs of breeding and all have made great dogs, from hogs, to cats, to blood dogs.
Dont just assume that because someone is new and has a new dog that the breeding isnt there.

If he is doing that good, breed him all you want, n o ones business but yours.

wow how do you know so much about Ike.  didn't know anyone knew about this breeding.  I was just going to let it go, but i greatly appreciate your words.  i think that some may not believe what an 18 week old dog can do so some automaticly miss judge.  The line is not known in east texas so that could be the issue.  if i breed or not i am proud of the dog and honestly don't care what is said of him.  Mike ya'll do a great job on the site!! 

One shouldn't make an assumption that because the breeding is there that the dog is breeding quality.  If all of that guys dogs made great dogs then somebodys standards are low or he knows something about breeding that no one else in the world knows.  
  I would agree its no ones business but it was posted on a public forum.  

   Disclaimer***** my opinion only.  In no way meant to be a bashing post.

guess my standards are to low..............................ill keep breeding my potlickers and catchin hogs

Mike, I wasnt suggesting anyone was bashing, I was trying to let a new guy know that in this crowd thick skin is a good thing. I to believe you guys do a pretty good job policeing out of line comments.

I think it is good that you spend alot of time with your pup..He should make a good hog dog...Gentics are impotant but putting the time into your dog is just important!!!Good luck with him and I would hang on to him.Keep us posted on how he is doing!! Sometimes typeing on this board people come off the wrong way when they did not mean it that way..

yes it is hard to convey feeling and expression through typed words.  I apoligize to Mike and other admin on this site for causing an up roar.  A simple post has turned into something real silly.  I like the dog, and i am keeping him, and if he turns into a good dog i may breed him.  I am new to owning a dog, but have been hunting since i was very little.  i have lots of learning to do.  I appreciate all comments good and bad.  I will post Ike's progress later down the road.  "get em boys" 

Congrats on your pup.  Nothing like watching your dog progress.  No matter how the dog turns out- you'll probably never sell him if he's your first.  I don't know everything, but I'd like to mention something to you based on experience since you're new to the hog dog scene.  Taking an 18 week old pup to the woods can be a very dangerous thing.  I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but you might want to work him on a couple rough sows so that he learns to RESPECT a hog before he encounters a bad one in the woods.  Good luck to you.

That is a very good post.  This man has passed great advise on to you.  I hope Ike turns in to a fine one.  Keep the pics coming.

you know that did cross my mind.  i think that is a great idea.  i will take you advice and go with it.  What about maybe taking him and keep him leashed until a bay and walking him up to it.  worth it or a bad idea?

Personally, I don't like the idea.  A lot of times it sends a message to them, that when they arrive to a bay, it is time to dive on.  It creates a "catchdog" mentality.  Nothing wrong with working 80 pound shoalts in a controlled woods environment until Ike grows a bit more.

good point.  so the million dollar question, they may open another can of worms.  What is a good age to start a pup in the woods. 

Great question.  However, it is not an age.  It is a frame of mind mixed with a stage in a dog's growth.  When they no longer run like a puppy, that is a good place to evaluate their reasoning skills.  I want to know that they see consequences before they do immature things in the woods.  This can often get them in trouble.

This is my ages for starting and what they get to do; at 3-6 months depending on the pup they start riding just to get the social skills, 6-9 months they start going to the bay depending on the pup, 9-12 months they start hunting out with the grown dogs depending on the pup. Now there are many varibles that come into play, like.....what do you want the dog to be, how grity, so on......I dont expect much from a pup until 6-9 months old. You can push a pup to much and take the fun out of it for them, then you end up with a help dog at best. I have seen some very young pups working great then by the time they are the right age to work they have no desire to.

I wouldnt do much in the woods with one until 6-9 months old and that would be very limited and controled.

I agree with cutter, generally I like to take the average cur dog at about 9 months, the average hound matures a little later.  The main thing you want the dog to do is to be able to protect himself and not put to much burden on a growing body....

now the advise above was for a full hunt....you can go for a walk in the woods with them at anytime, but if you know you are likely to be in a bay situation they need to be armed and ready for that...

I've got 2 17 week old hound pups right now.  When I go to the woods, I bring them with me. While we are riding the woods, they are learning that barking just to bark is unaceptable.  I use this time to set the foundation for future learning.  When I say "shut up", I make sure they are getting the point that this is just that.  It is time to shut their mouths.  It also gets them used to riding in the dog box banging around with other dogs.  Typically, I just place them in the same compartment alone with eachother, however, I have also placed them in the compartments with grown dogs.  This gets them used to making contact, and not taking exception to it.  No one likes a growly dog in a box.  When I am listening to the big dogs go, I will throw the pups out around the truck.  It gives them time to explore the woods, and all the smells that go along with it.  Generally, if my truck is parked where I turned out, there is some form of hog sign around.  It lets them go about learning to follow the scent without making them do it.  Ditches become an everyday event to cross, so they become very comfortable with working around water, even if it means crossing it where they have to swim.  Baby steps, that is where you should concentrate at this stage of the game.

Well this has turned into a great discussion as far as i'm concerned.  i can now see that there are many different technique's on training.  i guess i am going to take all of this advice and find a way to make it work for me and my dog.  Just to through something out there i would think that the environment you hunt in may change the way you do things, yes or no. 

Location as well as type of dog you hope to end up with should for sure vary your training techniques.  Training a walk in catch dog, would be basically doing a lot of lead work at this age.  However, a good strike dog, should have the opportunity to ride in the box, and get used to traveling in the woods.  If you are going to hunt pasture, it will vary than if you are hunting hardwoods.

When you and your hunting buddies go hog dogging, how do you usually do it?  I think you may get better advise if we all knew your style.

To make scense of all of this.... Every dog and every owner is diffrent.  Do what you belive is best for you and your dogs.  Your going to make mistakes along the way.  That is human nature.  Just learn from them.  Take advice from people.  If you like it use it if not dont. Your way of training your dogs could be alittle diffrent or alot diffrent than any other Owner. Good Luck and Good Hunting

well that's the problem.  We hunt on several different types of land on somewhere close to 10000 or 12000 acres as a guess.  The place we have been hitting hard is a 3000 acre plot that is all in grazer, coastal, or silage.  Now the silage and grazer is 20 to 25 foot tall and very hard for dogs to work in.  We usually play the wind and drive along side the fields.  i have some pictures on here with a pig we caught a few weeks back and u can really see the size of the silage, i believe it's calle "cutters" cant remember.  My buddies have good tracking dogs as well as good wind dogs, so we have the advantage depending on what place we are on.  Other places we have are full of white brush, cactus, and mesquites, and some places covered so think you can only crawl.  All places have a tank or pivot system somewhere on them and we ususally have luck tracking from there, although we have had nearly 5 inches of rain in the past 4 days.    

Y'all have 20 ft tall grazer?  Or are you talking about piles of Silage?

The dog in question will be a medium to long range dog with medium to cold nose, just watching what his litter mates are doing. He should be simi silent on trail with not much grit, just going by what his litter mates are doing and watching several generations of this bloodline. I wouldnt push him much right now, knowing the bloodline helps you to know what to expect and when. He will try to start his own hog early without you doing to much if he holds true to the bloodline.

yes we have 20 to 25 foot tall grazer and silage.  there is pictures somewhere on here.  Yes we hunt the actual silage in the field and we hunt the silage pits that have the fermiting silage.  sorry for the goofy faces, but this is a field of half silage and half grazer.  

(http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/martinsu25/silageBoar3.png)

My prefered method of starting a pup is this..........I don't like to start a young dog early or in a pen at all really.  I want pups to run loose and learn about life untill they start getting in too much trouble, baying cattle, harrassing barn cats, roaming too far from the house, ect.  That usually starts around 5 months with the dogs I mess with.  I don't really want to mess with them much untill this point then its time to catch them and put them up in a pen and put a little handle on them; lead right, load, hual, get out, don't mess with cattle unless sent, but other than that I don't want them to have much to do with me yet...they should still be hard to catch.  I will also show them what a hog is around thist time, as big a hog as I feel like messing with tied to a tree.  Do that a hand full of times but other than that I want them to know that hogs are in the woods and not tied to a tree or in a pen.  Keep them up and work on the handle untill the time gets right about 9-10 months old usually, but depends on the time of the year if deer season gets in the way I will wait untill its over.  If its bred in the dog they wont forget about it in a few extra months.  Your pup is almost 5 months and will be 9 months at the end of deer season, which will be just right.  Then start hunting them gradually and keep them in hogs twice a week if possible the weather will be right for it.  Lead them to bays for a few hunts to keep them out of trash, then let them hunt.  I've seen too many dogs spoiled by starting too young for what ever reason.  My  opinion is that they start hunting with puppy tendancies they very well may keep hunting with those puppy tendancies for the rest of thier life.  I say let them get the puppy out of them before you hunt them.  Its hard to do but patience is a virtue they say.  Good luck with your pup, but don't count your chickens before they hatch and I personally would wait on the breeding untill the dog has proven himself as a hog dog in the woods and then some, even if people are allready asking you.  If they are still asking you to breed to the dog in a year or two then you will know you have something.  Good looking pup anyway and he has breeding behind him, but thats just a start.

Waylon

Here is a reason to be careful hunting a young pup. Last weekend we took a 6 month old pup (Lady) that is good sized for her age, to see if she would go to a bay. She has been worked in a pen a couple of dozen times and was doing great although starting to get a little too gritty. Our dogs bayed up in a cut hay field about 90 yards out and when we turned our two catch dogs loose we turned her out as well. As I was getting the leashes and hobbles my buddy was already heading their way. Once I got started towards them the crazy SOB was heading back my way. He was chasing a shoat about 30 or so pounds for the reason of training a RCD pup. (They are starting to be hard to come by) Chasing my buddy was about 6 hogs from a 100 to 200#’s and hot on there trail was Lady. So hot on her trail was me trying to call her off while she was biting the nuts of a big boar. She turned him around at least twice that I know of before he finely hit a fence that knocked her off and I was able to catch her. Anyway, I was sick to thank she was fixing to get her self in a position she couldn’t win so make sure you feel good about them being on their own.  Needless to say, you never no what you will come across while out hunting…..

y would you turn a bay dog out the same time as a catch dog? from what i have seen that can turn a good bay dog in to a bad catch dog. i would turn the green bay dog 1st let her work then send the CD

Same dog box. That was the third bay she was on that night.