EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

I got a 5 month old pup whose fixing to be ready to start, he comes from real good blood and he already is baying hogs like a champ. I had a shoat escape a pen yesterday And he ran about 800 yards got it spun and sat back and bayed. my question is what can I do to try and get some range to this dog. Most my dogs right now hunt from my feet to about 300 yards in no sign, if they don't find a track they come back. I want to try to get this dog to keep ranging, if he has to go a mile to find a track I want him to. Granted I know that has a lot to do with how they're bred but is there anything I can do on my end to at least encourage it?


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I was thinking about doing mock hunts. And slowly but surely start dropping him farther and farther away from where the pig track starts.


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  Slim, Please don't take offense but don't rush that pup. For 5 months old, sounds like he is doing great but I would not rush it. Most dogs start ranging out as they mature. If he is out of long range parents he will probably be the same. If he is out of short range parents, he may never make a long range dog. If a pup is bred right, he will be out there hunting something. He might not know what to hunt but his instinct is telling him to hunt something. It is up to you to put him on the right track. I have seen many pups ruined by rushing them. JMO

No offense taken Cajun. Most you guys in here got more dog experience in your left pinky than I've got all together. I'm game to listen and will take all advice. I'm not gonna rush him, I have no intentions of throwing him into the woods right now or dumping him into a 5 mile race. But mock hunts running a 2-300 yards track through a creek bed should be good for him at his age.


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I've been raising and hunting the dogs I raise for a pretty long time.  Someone posted the video below on this site a while back, and I have to admit had I seen this years ago I could have saved myself a lot of frustration.  For the most part, I agree 100% with what this guy says.

My best advice for someone trying to get a dog to hunt deep is get a pup bred that way and just don't screw it up.  Easy to shorten a dogs natural range...sometimes without even realizing what your doing. 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGkdlpIxWbY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGkdlpIxWbY)

the two guys that already responded know what they are talkin about. I have to agree with bryant regarding simply purchasing one that comes out of a line of dogs that do what you are looking for them to do. My opinion doesnt mean much but I am on the side of the line that believes that you really can't teach a dog to range out, they either got it or they don't. sure you can attempt to munipulate em by hunting them with longer range dogs but even that is really a crap shoot, it may work, it may not.

Well good news is he comes from med range rough enough dogs which i guess won't be too bad. I don't have any dogs I'd call med range yet so we shall see what happens. https://vimeo.com/153443493 (https://vimeo.com/153443493) this is my pancho pup doing it by himself today.  




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I'd be careful posting videos like the second one just saw a fella on the evening news same video penned hog went to jail and seized his dogs said he was using hog as Bait for dog fighting.I am in Fl laws may be different but a hog in a pen and one in the woods fair chase are two totally different things.

Yeah... don't post any pics or videos of dogs catching in a pen. It is a felony in Texas.

Thanks mike for taking care of that. I apologize for that. Wasn't aware. Now I'm educated


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Maybe erase this post, and the above 3? Lol.  popo

^^^


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Just in case anyone is wondering pancho is catahoula with a little hound I believe and don't get me to lying about what kind. all I know is he came from Cscott who got him from a buddy and I like him!


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Don't train it with short range dogs.

x2...

we can bring out the best from a pup or a dog...but we can create bad habits in a pup just as easily and sometimes we do this without realizing that we are doing it...I have written about this several times on here when the topic comes up...

it is best to do this alone without anyone else around so you can take the time needed to get the results you want...

Take the pups straight from the kennel and put him in the dog box and take him straight to some good woods. I say this because you want your pup to be full of energy and chomping at the bit to do something...don't drop him in a right away or he will probably run down the road/pipeline etc...get your wheeler in the woods and turn the pups out and just kick back and ignore them...if they have it in them they will roll out...they make a good loop and they show back up move slowly a quarter mile or so and park it again...ignore the pups and they will get bored and roll again...

once they have it down and striking pigs you can road them...try to road cross wind or into the wind from the hogs...some folks make the mistake of moving along too fast...keep it slow and watch the pups...anytime they act like they are interested on a track stop and let them work it out...you are the captain and you are analyzing the scenario in front of you...the dogs are acting piggy for a reason...look around and see which direction the pig might have traveled and get off the wheeler and you look around as the dogs are doing and then you work your way towards where the hog might have traveled...that could be all that is needed to get the dogs on track...

if you are moving along and the dogs roll out as you are roading them stop and wait on them...this teaches them to be thorough about working out the track and they are not worried about keeping up with you because you will be there...this teaches the pups to use their nose to the fullest and not just looking for hotter tracks because they are worried about you moving forward...it is all about the dogs...we must be attentive to what is going on with them....we should do all we can to get the best out of our dogs...if they are winding and can't line it out stop and help them out...the wind could be channeling or skimming over the thick briars and weeds and they can't figure it out...you have an idea where the hogs are located so you get down wind and work towards the hogs and the dogs can pick up on the wind currents and go to the hogs...

follow a plan similar to what I have described and you will bring out the best from within your dogs when it comes to  casting, ranging, roading, winding and trailing...let your imagination be your guide...

Thanks for the reply Reuben. Good stuff and I'll be sure to keep all of it in mind as I move forward with my dogs and raising pups


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mine have never been real rangey in no sign, but ive changed my game a bit this year and it has worked well even on my grown dogs.

I keep them up in the wheeler and go to where I feel like dropping wether in sign or not. kill the wheeler, unclip the dogs and read a book or play a game on my phone. I don't talk to them much or mess with them, just leave them to it and they have started really getting a lot better about range.

one of my best ones has always been frustratingly short ranged, but after a month of doing him this way, he left out and stayed gone about 2 hours yesterday morning. never did wake up a boar hog, but hunted hard and I wasn't mad at him

The way Reuben described while reading is how I work my dogs. Mine will road from close to about 300 yards or so out front Yo-Yo ing back and forth. I find that about 3mph seems just right on speed. Gives them time to work an area at their pace not really pushing them. If they get piggy or seem interested in what may be off the trail I stop and wait. They tell me when it's time to move up. I have also done just as T-Bob said. Just find a spot that looks good and sit and wait. They will range slowly but surely if they want to hunt.

I think if you have a dog with a strong desire to hunt you can sit and they will learn to range on their own.


Shotgun
Arkansas

T-bob, I walk hunt a lot, in the last month I've got tired of them being so short range so I Started casting them at feeders off a rig at night and just completely ignoring them. The last 2 night it's taken about 20-25 minutes for them to finally roll past 300 yards but they've struck at over a mile both nights. Haven't stopped the hog(i think it's the same one we ran both nights) but I'm happy as all get out that they are ranging!!! (http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160204/9dc9060273e873b23163ae2f0907983a.jpg)


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First off, way to go, keep up the good work and don't get too frustrated. With your commitment to consistency, they will come around to their new way.

Gotta add though, I don't know your situation, but I know back when I walk hunted all the time I got ahold of some really nice dogs and very quickly knocked the range off of them by walking with them. I'm not assuming everyone who walk hunts will knock the range off their dogs, but I know I did by complete accident and didn't realize it till a few years into that method.
Now we cuaght gobs and gobs and gobs of good hogs and they always showed bottom, but it did knock the "free casting" range down on the dogs I was given.
Once I went back to roading, their range picked up a little, but not much, these days though I am commited to strictly casting them for the time being and in almost no time I have seen desired results.


Keep it up friend, best of luck

thats pretty cool slim, If I had bigger places to hunt I would do that with my dogs

appreciate it T-bob. And I can't disagree, I knocked a lot of range off but good thing is I do keep a few dogs that I think have enough "want to" that now I've started casting and it takes 20-30 minutes of just sitting and paying them no mind, but they will roll once they realize I'm not going anywhere. Over time I hope it starts getting to where soon as I dump em they chit and get. I don't want a dog to blow past tracks but I want one to kinda pick a general direction and go hunt that way for 6-800 yards, if they turn up nothing come back, if they hit a track, finish it! Do y'all think it's weird I've noticed these dogs ranging more now that I'm hunting nights by myself? I guess I haven't really casted or attempted much during daytime, usually with buddies and they're impatient and when I have friends that have never been I get antsy and probably push the dogs too fast. As for bottom that's what I'm working on right now. I appreciate the words of encouragement! Gonna go kick some mutts out in about an hour


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this spot is really small, well it was. Only about 350 acres. But my step dad got on the phone and called all the neighboring places. Just so happens to either be family or long time family friends who own everything around there so it's grown quite a bit. Probably almost to 1,000-1,200 acres me and him can now run hogs and coons on and I still have some big acreage phone calls to make to out of towners. That have property around there. It's 5.2 miles from the road where I can start to the Navidad river and I'm trying to square all that land up so I can hunt the heck out of it. This area didn't have hogs until about a year ago and the population there now has exploded.


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I'm sorry. 4.2 miles lol


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i dont want to offend anyone by talking about walk hunting but it usually does knock range off dogs because the dog is having to focus on keeping up with the man walking. what i do wiith mine is like reuben said, stright from pen to dog box, then when i get to the woods i tie them up for collars and to take a crap, then load them in my dog box on my fourwheeler and ride til im ready to cast, when i cast i head them in the direction i want them to go by their collar, if they come back after a small loop dont let them stand around and play or you be petting on them, grab them by their collar again and send them another direction or either load them straight back in the box, standing around is the worst thing to let them do they will do that instead of going hunting. and when their gone dont leave from where you casted them from like ride to another feeder and look, wait on them to come back or get a track going and they will learn your not going to leave them, it takes time and just keep doing it and they will eventually learn when they get let go their suppose to be looking for a track not waiting on you to lead the way. good luck

Patience is a virtue...especially when starting the young ones.  If you'll do just as you described by ignoring them, the ones with the natural hunting drive you're looking for will eventually get gone.  Once they figure out there are hogs to find, they will be blowing out of the box to get gone.

I use the same method when evaluating my litters of pups.  I'll even load the litters up and go dump them on a place where there aren't hogs.  My main objective is to sit (however long it may take) and see which ones eventually will get gone.  Multiple times of doing this will typically affirm the results...as it's usually the same ones over and over that are catching my eye.

not gonna lie, i laughed when I read the quote in the picture  ;D ;D ;D

glad you liked that Justin  ;D ;D 8)

That is my video. Range can be bred in, but even then that doesnt make it automatic. I can take 10 dogs that I get at 4 months old and if they have never been messed with I can usually get 8 of them to go long 1000+ yds by 1 year old by themselves.  Dogs naturally want to hunt, too often we mess them up

Ed, on those 1000 yard trips how long does the dog hunt? How fast is he moving on those rounds? And is the dog back tracking most of the time? I got a cut for sure that goes 800+ since I've had him and he will go side to side or make a loop a lot of the time... But he does have times where he will back track either right on the same track or not far from it.  Is that something that can be trained for a different outcome?


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In regards to the back tracking not sure if it is the case and I am no expert but young dogs do it alot learning to work a track and even the older dogs do it running out older tracks.

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seems like there gotta be more to your method than what you say in the video, or is it really that simple to you?


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DCH the situation you described sounds like the dog is working a track or feeding area track.


Shotgun
Arkansas

Shotgun, it can be anywhere. His speed varies but he will hunt like that every drop. I just want to get the back track gone for the fact that he is missing ground. He is a 5 year old and found plenty of hogs.  I got mostly short-medium range..... Mostly short though, lol. He ranges further than anything else in my yard. That range works perfect for me and where I hunt though. Long range really isn't what I'm after but they sure are fun to watch. I got friends that live and breath rangy dogs and they catch plenty of hogs with them. I'm more of a Mike Tyson style hog hunter myself lol


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Posts: 28


     Re: How to get range on a dog?
« Reply #33 on: Today at 07:40:52 am » Quote 

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Shotgun, it can be anywhere. His speed varies but he will hunt like that every drop. I just want to get the back track gone for the fact that he is missing ground. He is a 5 year old and found plenty of hogs.  I got mostly short-medium range..... Mostly short though, lol. He ranges further than anything else in my yard. That range works perfect for me and where I hunt though. Long range really isn't what I'm after but they sure are fun to watch. I got friends that live and breath rangy dogs and they catch plenty of hogs with them. I'm more of a Mike Tyson style hog hunter myself lol


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Do you bite them on the ear???

If it makes


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If it makes them hunt better I might try it


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(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160206/15df2f6aa24a99cd1088a57553a9d4f0.jpg) you can't cast walk hunting dogs they say


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(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160206/2e88299ff99a54de75e197b4dda6ef76.jpg)


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