Cast type dogs genetics or trained

[NLAhunter]

Me and a buddy was talking about this the other day I pretty well think it's mostly genetics for a dog to want to cast and go hunt I know there are exceptions but for most part I believe it's genetics I like to breed for all the motor I can get i can put brakes on if need be some but can't make em go if they don't want to I think we can cause things that our dogs do to and not realize it is happening I was starting a set puppies several years ago water was up some I was taking em in boat with a grown dog I would cast from boat walk to em when they got bayed well we catch hog the dogs naturally wanted to relay well I would call em back tie em back to keep from walking any farther make em follow me back to boat and cast em in different place well went to hunting off buggies some with em and was having a heck of a time getting them to relay when we caught hog then it hit me that I had caused this probably and really had to work on em to try get em to relay just something to think about and get a little conversation started up in here

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[Judge peel]

To me it’s bout  50/50 as it gets cuz you can ruin one bout the same as make one I have done both. It helps to have a good one to train off of and the dog to be bred right.  But at the end of the day it bout like a house wife you can only hope she does right cuz she going to do what she wants right or wrong


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[NLAhunter]

Lol you are right judge

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[Cajun]

I really believe it is genetic. If it is in them even a young dog will be out there hunting, He might not know what he is supposed to hunt but he will be out there hunting something. What you said above, I have said for years. I can put brakes on one but I cannot put a motor in one,

[Judge peel]

Cajun your right I learned a long time ago if the dog ain’t somewhat doing what you want from the start it probaly never will I think a lot of guys don’t get this part of it. I was talking to a young guy that’s been hunting with me and he hunts with few other fellas and he asked me how are your dogs so much better then the other guys dogs. I told him ego there trying to be the tough guy by catching the hog buying and trading dogs to try to get one that’s better then the one they got. Instead of trying to improve the quality of the dog there using and focus on that now it’s going to take some time and effort but they want quick fix. Nothing worth having happens quick that’s the main thing I am out there for the dog the hog is a bonus 


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[t-dog]

I believe it has a lot to do with what a person’s version of cast is, 100-200yd range is casting to some. The dogs that get deeper, maybe 400 and more, I believe are genetic. I have had dogs that I was able to beg into the 100-200 yard range but they weren’t going any further. I believe you can spoil a deeper casting dog into not leaving. Dumping them out in sign will do that pretty easy. They get lazy and don’t want to go look for sign after not having to for a period of time. How much of that it takes is different for each dog I believe. Dogs can definitely be reined in easier. If all you ever do is send a dog to a bay they probably aren’t going to cast well either. In my experience they tend to hit the ground and pose for magazine cover listening for a bark. Yesterday when we caught the last hog, we leashed all three bay dogs. I don’t remember who asked, but they asked if I thought is was necessary to leash the young gyp? I told them yes because I want her to feel like she is being forced to stay with us. If she stayed with us back to the buggy, I didn’t want her thinking that was ok. I also think she gets to see and read some older dog body language that might trigger some thought of her own. For example when they smell hogs on the way back to the buggy and want to go. Definitely, in my opinion, casting is genetic.


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[Judge peel]

T dog you right after we caught that hog that cut the dogs l was dealing with a mess and my grand son and I got mad at the boys because they never listen to me ride or die them two. They didn’t leash up stinky pork chop and Betty as my buddy came around to get us they done moved out 1000 yards and had a group bayed on the side of the road leaking like bad plumbing to say the least I wasn’t happy. Kinda how you know your dogs are going in the right direction at least to me. You know what t dog something you said is very true casting to some fellas is few hundred yards ain’t nothing wrong with that I would ever talk bad bout some ones dogs cuz they can say the same to me if they don’t like mines. But it’s crazy what people think. You know I have always done a lot of walk hunting and people have always said to me that my dogs must suck and be no good if you have to walk major difference in walking to your dogs that you casted off a lead vs walking your dogs to where you think there are hogs lol. But some peoples minds that’s not casting


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[Cajun]

  Sometimes the more handle you put on dogs, you can knock the cast out of them. For example I road my dogs before I go up north bear hunting. When I turn them out, they are going in all directions and I have to tone them in. I want them to stay ahead of the buggy. All my old dogs know the difference between roading and hunting but the youngsters are full steam ahead and you have to rein them in. That is also where I do a lot of trash breaking. If those young dogs leave the road and the old dogs do not, they get the button.

[Judge peel]

Good stuff Cajun I agree on the handle but I do prefer that loss of cast to handle the stick is where it’s at in my opinion distance out is great and all but if they give up what does it really matter


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[maverick10]

Do you think sometimes it’s the amount of hogs you put the dog on.. Here’s my story I might be on point with this conversation or not lol but let’s start with limpy at the age of 9 months the first hunt I took him on he was out doing his own thing my place of hunting is different from most we hunt mostly fields with brush acres that border the fields at young age he will go hunt and started finding hogs at 9 months he was going the distance when he found a track so now we are talking about his belly mate brother Ace was a late starter I started taking him to the brush around 11 months old see him and Limpy were both started on a hog at same age first hog they saw they lit up but fast forward I held Ace back cause I felt limpy was a bit more advanced than him but now after putting Ace on a few hogs at a young age he wasn’t finding till he hit maybe a 1.5 now it seems like you can’t leave Ace behind that boy will flat out do his own thing and put plenty of pork at the end of the table so if it’s genetics or trained to me I say it’s both cause if you put them on more hogs don’t you think your training him or her what to find now my rose dog was the same as Ace till something clicked in her head now that gyp can flat out find you a hog I think it’s the amount of hogs you put on a dog.. cause the casting part wasn’t there for ace and rose in the beginning now it seems like they roll out looking for a hog I think it’s just the amount of hogs you put on a dog that’s my opinion so to me think it’s both genetic and trained


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[Judge peel]

Don’t know if you ever thought this much about it but when a dog flat out takes out goes deep then finds a hog do you really think he found the hog or just bumped into it because he was out there. Then the dog kinda feels like hey if I run straight out here 1/2 mile I get one same dog different place cast out don’t find nothing comes back and doesn’t do much the dog isn’t hunting it’s been conditioned to run straight out to the jack pot. Just stuff I have seen and thought about. Seen lot of guys that catch lot of hogs then hunt different area and the same dogs kinda give up after they don’t find one right away


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[maverick10]

Judge I’ve seen the same thing too I’ve seen my dogs do the exact same thing they go hunt then come back and don’t want to leave out like there telling me look fxxxer there’s no hogs in here and they will stay by the truck but move to another place and then you see like a light come on them like game on there’s hogs in here..


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[maverick10]

Sorry off topic but one thing I hate is when some people ask how far do your dogs range while hunting and I’ve give the same response ft to miles lol


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[t-dog]

Maverick, to me it’s still a genetic issue with your dogs. I’ll use this example; you had three littermates that will all cast well but two of the three didn’t do right out of the gate. You realized early on that the one dog was more advanced mentally. He was the exception of the three in the sense of early maturity. There aren’t a lot of families or lines that can do it solo at the age of 9 months consistently. They may leave and be busy but not the same as how you described Limpy. Many of those early starting, barn stormers top out and don’t get much better after a certain point. Your other two I would bet were busy just not striking and being a lead dog type. If I’m right, genetics had them out there in a position to learn. It just took a little maturity for their math to all add up. The opportunity to learn, a ride to the woods and the presence of desired game, is a must for any dog in any hunting discipline. Some lines start early and people breed for it. I know the Old Man has mentioned that he expects his to start and contribute pretty early on. I’m a lot the same way. We, my hunting circle, just culled a litter. That are just over 18 months old. They will piggy back and cast with other dogs, but they won’t cast solo. Once you get into hogs they look like all stars, find and bay their own hog, but only after another dog has done the heavy lifting. The norm of my dogs is to be able to do the job at 18 months without someone else holding their hand. I firm believer in putting young dogs in a position to have the opportunity to be the lead dog. If my young dogs are out there striking and baying ahead of my older dogs on a regular basis, then my old dogs probably aren’t up to snuff. With their experience, a young dog should hardly ever beat them.


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[maverick10]

T-dog your on point at point I told myself hell let’s just take rose ace and Donald from Donald Breckridge line together without our more season vet dogs and they started finding at one point it was just them 3 and they were all finding there own hogs and that made me proud so your right about what you said


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[Slim9797]

I think most people ruin casting for young dogs before they’re ever old/good enough to really make you notice. It’s got to be genetic to a point but I don’t think there’s a “cast gene” I think there are dogs that have hunt and some dogs who would never go farther than the porch  to look for a porkchop if they were starving.

I’ve seen it all too many times from friends and people we hunt with that ask how our dogs cast so good or say theirs won’t. Then I watch them let pups hang around, get impatient with dogs trying to work something and push them off of it, or they just put down and go to driving dogs without giving them a chance to leave. I see all of this now because there was a time when it was me who was that guy. If we weren’t catching hogs we were wasting time. Day I quit worrying about catching the hogs and started concerning myself with making the dogs, I started catching more hogs and.l the dogs got a lot better. I know one thing to be 100% true. Your dogs will never cast if you do not cast them.

We do not let dogs hang out, especially pups and yearlings. you get 1 chance to re cast. If not, you go back in the box. And very seldom will we send a dog that didn’t cast to a hog bayed by dogs that did. Pretty quick you’ll find out if that dog wants to go be a hunting dog, or if he’s just as cool with riding coat tails and In the dog box.

We send our dogs and sit on our butts. If they ain’t running one or bayed. We do not move. Don’t care if sketch comes back and in English tells me there isn’t a hog in 3 counties. If you hang out, you get put up, and we sit still till everything is back or we are bayed. And then we might load up, drive in a 2 minute circle and come cast them back out on the same spot.



https://vimeo.com/1046895753 there’s dogs bred all kinds of ways in there from 10 months to 10 + years old.


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[maverick10]

Slim your on point I can’t stand a pup to be by my feet I have a Limpy son he’s 10 months old and yesterday I watch him follow and put his nose on the ground he was following the old dogs in brush and everything and he finally learned a bay now he’s been at every caught hog these past few hunts


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[Judge peel]

Good points fellas. If a pup or dog gives a good solid effort no laying around weather it’s 250 or 800 don’t matter to me but once they hit a good track or wind one I don’t want them giving up even if they lose the hog but keep trying we can work with that can’t do much 40 yards in front of you


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[NLAhunter]

I agree I cast dogs i expect them to leave i don't let em hang around buggy just laying around they go back in the box on puppy I give em 8 or 10 trips or whatever I think that particular dog needs but when i decide he is out of free trips i get switch and sure enough switch him till he leaves that buggy and goes somewhere few times of that they don't want to leave probably all my feed they are eating

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[Reuben]

I also believe casting is genetics…how they cast and range also has to do with how they are handled just as what age of tracks they will take…

The want too, to want to range out and hunt has to be there…for longer range casting turn the dogs out and let them range out…when they check in send them out again and they will get deeper…move the atv slowly and stop now and then…this will encourage casting out further…

For closer ranging and for taking hotter tracks move around quicker with the atv and don’t wait on dogs on colder tracks…this type of hunting keeps the dogs closer and they learn to only take the hotter tracks…i know this because I have a friend who hunts his dogs this way…

Personally I like to do all I can to get the best out of my dogs…

Genetic selection for natural ability…
Get a shoat and put an 8 week old pit bull pup on the ear and it latches on…that would be a pup to put up and keep because he will catch if trained and worked right…

A 4 month old cur pup gets turned loose in the woods and casts out and checks in and recasts out on its own in a different direction…well this pup is a keeper, and if the training is right…and if the breeding is right this pup will have the potential to reproduce early starting dogs that cast well…