blue pit bulls

[Scott]

So what do we call it when the hog and dog are separated, the pit is leashed up but begins chewing everything down around him to go back to the hog?  He has had the chance to quit but refuses to.  Isn't this how dog fights are?  They fight, separate, and fight again.   Sounds the same to me.  

How many times were they separated, was it the only dog on the hog?

[ETHHunters]

I dont know if this has anything to do with gameness but the first pit i had got in the pen with 7 hogs. When I found them all the hogs were dead and the dog died later. There were a couple in there under 100 pounds but the rest were decent sized hog and one large boar hog.

[Scott]

I dont know if this has anything to do with gameness but the first pit i had got in the pen with 7 hogs. When I found them all the hogs were dead and the dog died later. There were a couple in there under 100 pounds but the rest were decent sized hog and one large boar hog.

I would say that was a bulldog....

[Nick]

mostly APBT's, have shown that those trained to pull for their owners satisfaction (gameness)

Nick, where did you get your info from. Where did you get this definition of gameness. I think you may need to do some more research on your dogs. Gameness cannot be taught, if that was the case any dog could be a catchdog. My definition of gameness -- willingness to continue despite taking punishment.  Don't confuse gameness with aggression. An aggressive dog is not necessarily a game dog. People who don't understand this take aggressive dogs, breed them and make more aggressive dogs. In the 1970s a pit bull attack was unheard of. The men who had the dogs knew what to look and breed for. It wasn't until the dogs ended up in the hands of ignorant thugs that pit bull attacks started taking place. BAD BREEDING. Not knowing the difference between gameness and aggression. In my opinion, the APBT has the most stable temperament of any dog. I raised gamedogs for years and never had a dog just turn and attack. They are what they are, if I had a dog that acted funny towards people I knew it from the first day I had them. The stories of these dogs (most of the time) turning and just attacking is BS. The dog was human aggressive the whole time and I guarantee the owner knew it. The phrase "turn on" is a whole different story than what it has been recognized as.  Nick, I don't expect you to understand everything I'm saying, people with gamedogs know exactly what I mean.  I'm sorry, I started rambling on. Nick, my advice is to search and study up on the gamedog, maybe even own a few then form  your own opinion. Don't believe everything the media tells you.

My source of information came from a random book I come across at the pet store, "Training Secrets for Bully Breeds." The book is comprised of several articles written by professional trainers and some dog behaviorists. Dr. Ian Dunbar, a world reknown trainer/animal behaviorist, was contacted for some articles since he loves the bully breeds.

They state that although "game" originated as a fighting term, it refers to a dog's tendency to continue in the face of adversity. What I was refering to in my previous post was that these breeds thrive off of their masters satisfaction and will continue to try as hard as they can for as long as they can. They then go on to talk about weight pulling competitions and dog fighting, stating that owners will position themselves in such a way that the dog can always see them rooting for them.

Like I said before, I am no expert by any means. I just like to read and this information is what the experts have to say about the subject.

[Beejay]

Most of those experts probably never owned a bulldog. Look for books written by Richard Stratton this should help you.http://http://www.amazon.com/Truth-About-American-Bull-Terrier/dp/0866226389www.amazon.com/World-American-Pit-Bull-Terrier/dp/0876668511

[Randy_P]

I keep hearing people in general talk about these potbellied blue dogs.  Just because they are blue does not make them potbellied or "bully"   They can be just as leggy as any other color of pitbull.  We can argue all we want to but the pitbull breed has been done an injustice by breeding for a particular look or color as well as many other breeds. Now they are crossing english bulldogs into the pitbull breed to create an extreme bully.  Ridiculous if you ask me.   I agree with beejay.  game dogs and catch dogs are two different animals. 

[Beejay]

Agteach, your right. Just because they are blue doesn't generalize them into a potbellied category. It is just my way of refering to them in a negative manner because I think they are an injustice to the true APBT.

[jeffeasttx]

Well i have found this post pretty interesting. I do understand where people are talking about breeding game dogs, and not wanting a pretty dog. I want and will only keep a jam up catch dog, with that being said if he was the best catch dog in the world, if my 2 yo little girl can't go out there and feed him i won't have him, i don't care what color or bloodline he came from. Like i posted before, i have a blue and white male pit, and a blue female pit, i have never had any problems out of these dogs letting go, quitting or anything. I bought the blue female (coco) off of this website, i was a little worried when i bought her since she hasn't ever really been cut. The first week i took her hunting we caught 5 hogs and had her cut on 4 of them, and never once did she let go, or even attempt to want to quit. SHe found one hog by herself. So i don't care weither the dogs are blue, red, black, orange or grey, as long as they have what it takes to live in my hard and catch hogs for me i will take them.

[nate3]

I'm with cracker on this one, when you breed for a specific trait, you take away from other traits. I used to breed game dogs and when I would see a yard full of big pretty dogs I would turn and go home. You breed for looks and other traits suffer. In a bulldog the trait is gameness, cut and dry. I also believe you cannot train gameness(heart) it's bred in them. The funny thing is, 20 years ago there were no blue pits. This is my point, you don't breed years and years of black or brown or white dogs and all of a sudden blue dogs turn up. I believe the line of blue dogs are not the true gamebred pits of years ago. Something had to be crossed in to get the size and color they are today. One hundred pound blue dog, how did that happen! I believe people breeding these petbulls are ruining the best breed in the world. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying blue dogs won't catch or will let go. I have seen a blue dog catch and hold. Just in the long run, it will destroy the true APBT. Just my opinion to each his own.

Beejay,I agree w/ you.


Can blue dogs catch...yes but are they true APBT's? ....no,not historically,the y have "pine in the oak pile" not the real thing,too much other breeds infused for color,size etc.

I think everyone who owns any form of a APBT should study the old lines and game dogs and the history behind them.

Please understand this is for historical purposes only....also notice,no blue dogs.


Also,I didn;t pick the music,just the links for reference.

I agree with you Underdog. Those big blues might be good for pulling but I don't think they could catch like a old school pitbull, standard scotts type bulldog or a Dogo. Some of these BIg blues are over 100 lbs at 18 to 19 at the shoulder. That and a very short muzzle which would make breathing harder for a dog.
Underdog you have some nice Bulldogs=).





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9nnF1AeY6A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rsh-7KlDLjQ&NR=1&feature=fvwp



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_l7DuPve7yI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPXE_JALTLY&feature=related

[UNDERDOG]

Thanks Nate....

I am not downing the blue dogs but some of these cariactures of dogs that some are producing is pure dis-function. Many here have posted some decent looking blue dogs that work and thats fine by me,I always say "feed what you like and like what you feed" BUT...don't discount the history of the true APBT,whan the blue dogs first started being seen they were the AM staff/UKC dogs and they were still functionally built,for the blue lovers researsh the old york and gaff and watchdog dogs bloodlines...this is were the functional blue dogs started (still not game bred) but not short,fat blue hippos either.

Beejay mentioned a book or two,any of the old Stratton books are good for some basic info,the Jessup book "the working pit bull" is good as it shows them in a positive light as well as many pics of the early blue dogs befoe the went south,the Farron book (the complete game dog) is good. One thing I noticed too is some time young folks asking how to build a chain set up,dog houses etc. most of the above mentioned books go into great detail about these things,may help some. BTW...I have a few doubble coppies of some of these books I may make a deal on   


And maybe it was the other thread but dogs w/ game bred peds can be found w/o the high prices,even if it is dogs down from game dogs,probabally will be more stable overall than a hippo also as they are more of a ban dog than a bulldog anyhow.

Any way...sorry to go on but I just think we as dog hunters/owners and especially owners of bull breeds should learn and educate our selves better as one day "they" won't let us have any of them.

[coach]

Blue pits were around 20 yrs ago we owned some now they weren't all blue, fat, and these things that can't walk 100 yds without passing out, but were more of the brindle and smoke color. The dogs we bred were tall, leggy dogs used to run. These dogs were always used for catching. Over the years the same dogs we sold for 50 to 100 bucks we found were going for 1500. who knew we were sitting on a goldmine for those types of breeders. We really didn't care for that stuff just wanted a dog that did the job we were looking for. Catching and Holding hogs.

[elliscountyhog]

Another pit bull thread

[Beejay]

Gotta love em, gets everyone worked up.

[ETHHunters]

Gotta love em, gets everyone worked up.

Not everyone just the same ones everytime!

[Beejay]

Funner every time

[UNDERDOG]

hey what about this book and author


THIRTY YEARS WITH FIGHTING DOGS by George C. Armitage




stratton is over rated and i have had some farron dogs there are culls in every breed and every strain but through all this i have never seen a bigger injustice than this AMERICAN BULLY that these people have said are APBT and most are blue dogs

I have that book also....Stratton is overated to a point but the book do give good basic info on the APBT in general as well as being more accesable books than some of the others.

[cody1offroad]

I got a buddy that post on here but he hunts with us he raises what you call game dog most of them are double register and red noses some black one out of the budro line he breeds them to lock now they will all jump up and grab a rope and lock he got 5 or 6 dogs but none of them will hit and lock on a hog and i have always had rednose they have alway worked for  us i got to registerd pits blue right and the will knock a pig down it has nothing to do with color it just the dog

[redriverslim]

Blue dogs are just "NON-GAME-BRED" dogs with blue color, period.  they may be good at catching hogs, I don't know, but they are NOT TRUE American Pit Bull Terriers.  They are too big, too bulky, heads too big, lack stamina and endurance and HEART.  Now, with that being said, they may make great catch dogs on hogs, and I think that was the original question.  When I say they lack heart, I mean compared to the elite of the breed.  They may have all the heart they need to catch a hog, and that's good enough, but they are not gamedogs, never were, never will be.  Also, there is no such thing as "lock" or "lockjaw".  A bulldog's working parts that make up his jaw structure are no different than any other dog, a good one just won't let go because he chooses not to let go, has nothing to do with lockjaw.  Also, this "locking" is an urban legend.  The best fighting dogs will gladly let go of one hold to get a better one.