RAW MEAT DIET FOR DOGS - COMMON MISCONCEPTIONS

[Black Gold]

So I don't hijack Bayhard's thread anymore than it has been already....

One of the best benefits of feeding RAW (other than protein/vitamins/minerals) is that it cleans and strengthens dogs teeth and gums.  Gum disease and oral infections can lead to multiple health problems in dogs.  Chewing raw bones and ripping pieces of meat from the bone is like brushing teeth.  This is very important for overall health.

Some common misconceptions feeding RAW:

Chicken bones will splinter and stick in a dogs throat:  FALSE   Only when cooked....Bird bones are soft and pliable and easily chewed by dogs when raw.

Fish bones will stick in a dogs throat and stomach:  FALSE  Again....Only when cooked.....Dogs can eat fish whole...the only thing I avoid are catfish fins.

Some like to avoid large mammal support bones because prolonged chewing on them can chip or break teeth.

For beef, lamb, pork, or any other large mammal just avoid support bones in the legs.....Feed ribs, backbones, and even skulls.
Pigs heads can be picked up cheap and the butcher can cut it in quarters on the ban saw.......I wouldn't feed feral pig heads because disease is spread in feral swine mainly thru saliva.

Search this website for "RAW MEAT" and read the posts......the one book I posted up is a wealth of knowledge.....My dogs are much healthier since I've been feeding RAW....my kennels don't stink, and my feed bill is a fraction of what it was with kibble......

[TrueBlueLacys]

Did that thread get deleted? I just tried to respond and it said it was gone. Anyway, this is what I was writing, I definitely think it applies to this topic as well...

Here's a calculator on how much to feed when you do raw: http://www.raw4dogs.com/calculate.htm. Essentially it is 2% of the dog's body weight if they are fat, 2.5-3% to maintain weight, and some hunting dogs may need 4-5%. My Lacy hovers around 30 pounds, on average we hunt every other week, and she gets about one pound a day.

Do not grind up or cook the meat in any way. Just chop it down to edible portions and throw it in the kennels. Cooking leaches nutritional value. And you don't want to grind it up because you need whole bones. They need chewable, digestible bones - like those found in poultry and fish as well as the neck bones and ribs of larger animals - for calcium and other important nutrients.

But never feed a dog *cooked* chicken or fish bones. That is when they can splinter and cause internal damage. It is like putting clay in a kiln, it starts out soft and pliable but turns brittle when cooked. Bones are the same way, they are actually moist when they are raw but cooking dries them out.

I do know people that feed a little bit of hide, it can help slough out intestinal worms, but I don't think there is any special nutritional value in it. Dogs will eat the heck out of heads too, brains and eyeballs and all. They do need organ meat, especially liver, but kidneys are good for variety.

The basic premise is to feed whatever the dogs would find in the wild. As hunters, it should be especially cheap and easy to provide that type of diet. All the leftovers from your own kills, your friends, your family, your taxidermist... anything that the people don't want, the dogs will love. But I feed primarily chicken quarters from the grocery store and it is still far cheaper than the kibble I used to buy.

Krystal, it's funny you mentioned road kill, cause I've heard some crazy stories about that. Honestly, if the animal just got hit, it's a great idea. You won't pay a dime, you're cleaning up the roadways and the dogs certainly don't care. But there is no way I have the stomach for that!

[buddylee]

I can get alot of deer scraps from the deer cooler but not enough to feed all year long. The meat I get is feet, tendons and fat. Will it hurt to feed the scraps and dog feed mixed together ??

[longshot]

FYI:
picking up Roadkill is great but keep in mind it pretty much ILLEGAL so dont think that if the game Warden catchs you with a roadkill deer he wont give you a ticket


I see Axis hit all the time and heard it is illegal to pick up ANY roadkill becuase it was not taken by a legal means.   

I would look this up before you consider that a valid source of regualr food
Longshot

[uglydog]

here is the e-book that I found most helpful about Raw diet

http://leerburg.com/pdf/feedingrawdiet.pdf

alot of good info can be found at http://leerburg.com

[uglydog]

Roadkill Possum? illegal too? guess I am an outlaw after all 


Seriously though also those have access to chicken houses, would be awesome to feed whole chicken

[Black Gold]

There are 2 disciplines of thought on feeding RAW.....Some think you need to supplement with vegetables and some think 100% meat is all that is needed.  For me it all comes down to vitamins and minerals.  If you feed nothing but chicken quarters 100% of the time you might need to supplement, but like TrueBlue said, supplementing with organ meat and fish adds tons of vitamins and minerals not found in basic muscle meat.  I subscribe to the 100% meat theory, but make sure I give a good variety on top of my foundation of chicken.  Fish and organ meat adds tons of nutrients.  Eggs are also a good supplement.....I go raw on eggs as well....(I know there is info out there that says that's not good, but I disagree)

Remember.....In this internet age you can find 100 articles written by PHD's for something and 100 more written by more PHD's with the exact opposite view.  I take everything I read with a grain of salt and look for the proof in the pudding.  Your dog will show you if something is not right.....When your vet says how good your dog looks then you know something is going right, but the true litmus test is seeing your dog and how it's diet is positively effecting it physically and mentally......That is the proof I look for.

I also look at the politics involved....The dog food industry is a billion dollar industry......When that much money is involved politics get involved......How many vets you know that sell dog food?  A lot of it comes down to $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$..............

I would challenge anyone to follow a RAW meat diet for 8 weeks with absolutely no kibble and see for yourself what feeding RAW can do for your dogs.  Kibble aint getting any cheaper.....what do you have to loose? 

[dabutcher]

FYI:
picking up Roadkill is great but keep in mind it pretty much ILLEGAL so dont think that if the game Warden catchs you with a roadkill deer he wont give you a ticket


I see Axis hit all the time and heard it is illegal to pick up ANY roadkill becuase it was not taken by a legal means.   

I would look this up before you consider that a valid source of regualr food
Longshot

actually, if you call your local game warden or wildlife biologist's office, 9 times out of 10 they will let you take the carcass.  BUT YOU MUST LEAVE THE HEAD.  no matter if it's a doe or buck the head must be left.  i was allowed to pick up 2 in the last couple weeks. 

[Wmwendler]

Cody, do you take out of guts of the fish before you feed them?  Are there even Any paracite concerns with fish? 

Waylon

[dabutcher]

i can't comment on the other fish he uses but i know for sure he gets whole tilapia from me at work and they are gutted. 

[Black Gold]

Waylon,

Perch I freeze and feed whole....Bigger fish I gut and freeze then feed......When the price is right I buy whole talapia and they come gutted......I feel that freezing kills anything and everything I'd worry about in a fish......

[Monteria]

I don't feed fish often, maybe twice a year. When I do, I just go to the butcher shop and ask them for the salmon heads. Its scrap to them while the eyeballs, brains, scales, cartilage and oils are a delicacy to the dogs.

I should feed fish and organ meat more often than I do. The more diligent that I am with liver, the better the dogs coats, skin, eyes and gums look.

PS: I prescribe to the 100% raw meat theory. No veggies or grain.

[Black Gold]

PROOF POSITIVE:  Just got back from the vet.  Took my 18 week old 3/4Dogo 1/4 Catahoula in for a round of shots.  Vet didn't believe me that she was only 18 weeks old....Said she had a huge frame and good muscle, but without all the plumpness that a puppy that age normally has....He thought she was 6 months or older.....He looked in her mouth and saw that she still had a few puppy teeth being pushed out by adult teeth....He admitted I was correct on her age because this happens between 16-20 weeks of age.....He was impressed with her frame and muscle development......I just smiled!   That's the puddin' right there that I look for!!!

[dabutcher]

so does anyone feed turkey parts??  i've got drumsticks and wings that i'm gonna have to toss.   can you feed that to your dogs?? 

[uglydog]

Yes feed it as long as it is 100% RAW

I would not be against feeding possums, coons, squirrel snad any other animal I may even feed ferrel cats if they keep getting in my garage!

[Black Gold]

DaButcher,

UglyDog was able to get 2,000 pounds of turkey a few months ago.....Both our dogs ate a LOT of TURKEY!!!

[shawn]

lol @ ferrel cats, for some reason cats stay WAY AWAY from my yard (except my wifes and she rules the place, lol)


ive noticed that about the cheapest meats you can get are chicken quarters and beef liver, would a diet consisting of just those two be enough?

[Monteria]

Chicken quarters and beef liver are a perfect dog diet. On average, the chicken has exactly the correct proportions of protein, bone and fat. Add in the vitamin and oils from secreting organs (liver) at a rate of 10% of total weight and you have a perfect meal.

Steve

[shawn]

thats cool, think im gonna try it for a month or 2 and see what happens, cant hurt, dog food is getting outrageous.

one thing i am worried about, i got one dog that is nuetuered (not my doing) and is a little on the chunky side even though i feed him less than i normally would a dog his size (40-45 lbs)

think on an all meat diet is this gonna make this dog fatter?

[Monteria]

I have found that dogs on a raw diet carry their weight very differently than the same dog would on kibble.

A kibble dog who looks like a couch potato or "Chunk" from The Goonies will look more like a star athlete or Arnold Schwarzenegger on raw.

Rather than bulk, a raw diet should produce lean muscle mass. Granted, lacking exercise can produce fat no matter the diet.

Also keep in mind that each dog is different as are their metabolisms. I have some dogs who require 2.5% of their body weight per day in feed and I have one who gets 5%. Don't be afraid to adjust their volumes up and down until you find the correct % for each dog.

Steve