Best cut vests

[hoghunterdfw]

What have yall found to be the best type or brand of cut vest for a running catch dog that needs optimal protection, moveability and motion, and won't over heat? I have been looking at the Los Cazadores dogo webpage and their claims about cut gear, but need some feedback. Thanks

[Scott]

The thing to remember is that cut gear is just an added layer of protection to minimize injury. The dog can still get cut, poked, or sent to the happy hunting grounds while wearing it.

Personally, I think their gear is a little expensive, but the clientel to which they cater are willing to shell it out. If you're gonna use the dog as a running catchdog, I'd look at the boar bib from Uglydog.

[hoghunterdfw]

Thanks I talked to them yesterday and cody weiss said to wait until the first week of march for their new vest thats going to be released. He said the guardian with a bib is to bulky. But I heard good things about ugly dog ranch.

[hogdoggintexas]

look at the cool vest by www.rpoutdoors.com

[uglydog]

Claims that wearing one vest over another vest will prevent overheating are BS. Anydog can overheat under the right circumstances with or without a vest.

You are talking about Hunting Hogs, meaning it is unpredictable any time you turn your dog loose.

Facts:
There are about ten companies manufacturing vests. many more selling the same patterns with other names on them. The pattern and individual fit per individual dog are going to determine the range of mobility the dog has. Out of the vests available there are only 3 patterns I would even consider putting on any of my dogs.

Then you must understand the materials the vests are made from. Most people don't know the diiference between Kevlar, TurtleSkin, Ballistic Nylon or Cordura, and many different grades of those materials.

The sad part is most the people selling the vests don't understand how they work for hog dogs either, they are just trying to make a buck.

You may have a lesser vest that never gets cut through, then the next have one of the high quality vests get a poke through, in your mind the one that did not get cut is better, and that is not the way it works, just because the same dog did not catch the same hog, or stay caught the same amount of time all factor in the way the vest performed.
You cannot compare Apples to Oranges .


I have two types of vests that go on my dogs PERIOD. They are two different patterns  (but similiar) very similiar materials Cordura Nylon (also known as Ballistic depending on who is blowing the BS your way) and Kevlar core.

Do my dogs overheat? NOPE, that is not because of the vest ,it is because of the way I handle my dogs, knowledge and experience help prevent this

Is IT ALWAYS Avoidable? NOPE, that is a risk you take turning your dog loose, sometimes things just happen like the hog breaking, say your prayers before you hunt.

Do the Vests Protect My dogs? Absolutely

Have my dogs ever been cut wearing a vest? Yes, they have, but the vest saved their lives 100 times over what the minimal damage the dog recieved in comparison to haveing to replace a dog, or the VETt bills and down time for a dog to recover. My dogs have never recieved a life threatening injury wearing the vests.

How do I substaniate the claims I make? The proof is always in the Puddin. I have been using the very same vest for years, we recently have only added one new vest to our gear, same manufacture and materials as our older vests, but still use the same vests as we used to sell.
Here is the best proof I have to offer Captain Morgan 10 years old, Lucy Lou 7 Years old, Cotton 4 years old, Xerox 3.5 years old, Smoochy 3 years Old, these dogs were raised from pups here and are still here. all these dogs wear/wore the same vests and and are still protecting my catchdogs., and will for several more years. These vests are used several times a week year round.

Do the math yourself, but in my book it comes out about $50 a year or less to buy the best & keep my dogs safe, when I can get a few years out of the same vest . I don't know about yall but that is awful reasonable in my mind.

How Do Would I Go About Keeping my dogs from Injuries? Stay out of the woods!

I have seen people trying to find gear to cover all areas of the dog, this just gets ridiculous.
The more areas you cover on your dog, the more risk you put your dog in for not being able to move and take care of himself. I have seen dogs get put down on the ground by a hog and the not not be able to get his feet under him because the owner put too much on the dog where he was unable to move. Small/tight leg holes and vests that are too long on the body, hinder the dogs mobility.

Alot of people put the vest on their dogs and tighten them all the way up. That is like putting a straight jacket on your dog and telling him to go to work. One  thing air can't circulate building heat, and two the can't get out of a bind when it gets down, Nor can it sit or lay with out cutting off circulation in its belly area.

By the way vests don't breathe. Anybody claiming that, well more BS. Most materials are coated for water protection and don't allow air to flow, and then when its layered. NO AIR at all goes through. The only air circulation is going to be through the air being able to flow between your dog and the vest.

The vests you see on dogs in Pen Work don't have to be the real deal. They only have to work for a few minutes at a time, so therefore most  hold up and do the job well. When you are looking at a vest that will be on a dog for hours at a time, The Fit of the vest will be  seriously more important in an uncontrolled enviroment, like in the woods.

If you want Garuntees - Buy Insurance

If want a vest to last and protect your dog, don't buy something with plastic buckles or cheap materials.
Just like trying to buy a good dog, look for something proven and tested. Anybody that can sew can make a vest, but experience puts quality materials with quality craftmanship, then puts it to the test of time, and produces a quality product.

[got2catchem]

Definantly, words from experience..Good Post Uglydog I might need to change some things up myself.......

[TexasHogDogs]

uglydog

Do my dogs overheat? NOPE, that is not because of the vest ,it is because of the way I handle my dogs, knowledge and experience help prevent this

Thank you , Thank you , Thank you I have been saying this over and over to friends that want to cry about dead are badly cut up dogs but dont want to protect them because they say the vest will make a dog over heat are they cant move its B.S.!.  I live in Texas and I hunt all summer long in corn feilds and everywere else all my cur dogs wear cut vest and I have yet to have one die from over heating are really even get one over heated  but before I got smart I had them die from hogs killing them.  A vest cost a lot less than replaceings a 3000.00 dog !  These vest have saved these dogs over and over and over and it never became more apparent to me than when we started video tapeing some of the hunts and bad boar bays and catches when you can sit down and watch it in slow motion and see the licks and hits these dogs take it will amaze you are it did me .  I would not run one of my dogs now with out them they are just plain ruff dogs .  I learned my lesson the hard way !

TexasHogDogs
Jim

[Black Gold]

UglyDog Wrote:

Do my dogs overheat? NOPE, that is not because of the vest ,it is because of the way I handle my dogs, knowledge and experience help prevent this

I agree. 

We have recently had requests for vests with eyelets put all throughout the body of the vest.  There is no way I will cut dozens of holes in a vest that is designed to protect a dog from getting cut.  People see new fads and dont stop to think about the biology behind something....A dog does not sweat and cools its body thru panting (tongue) and the pads of its feet.  Air moving across its body does very little to cool the core temperature of a hot dog becuase sweating is not taking place. (unless the air is super cooled and flowing extremely fast)  Temperatures getting to a dangerous point are in the dogs brain anyway and not under the vest.  The cooling of a dog is achieved much faster by hydrating the dog and wetting the dog.  If you do the math and figure the surface area of the little eyelet holes you would give your dog 5 times the air if you would just order a 3/4 length vest.....

Just one example of a sales gimic used to glorify a bay vest and take the focus off the material used.

I've said this many times and I'll say it again......I stand behind our vests and gear. (WILD BOAR USA-UGLY DOG RANCH)  We use the best materials out there and our reputation (user feedback) speaks for itself.  Out of the 10 or so companies out there that sell cut vests only about 4 or 5 have their own brands unique to them.  Out of those 4 or 5 there are only 2 or 3 that use any material besides cordura......Out of all 10 companies I know of only 2 that actually hunt hogs with dogs! 


Let me help people understand cut vest material:

Cordura, rip-stop, ballistic nylon, and other simmilar names are almost identical material as far as cut resistance goes.....They are easily cut thru when not combined with other materials .....many vests out there are being marketed as cut vests and are nothing more than a glorified bay vest.  If your buy a vest that is 2 or 3 layers thick and is thin and flexible then it better have at least one layer of kevlar inside or you have nothing more than a bay vest.

  There is one company that sells what they are calling their kevlar vest but instead of paying for the expensive kevlar they are buying a materail that is woven with kevlar stands mixed with other materials.  KEVLAR ONLY WORKS WHEN IT IS 100% KEVLAR.....not kevlar stands mixed with cotton....
Kevlar is a manilla color......NOT BLACK AND MANILLA!  Ballistic grade kevlar (the good stuff) runs anywhere from $45-$50 a yard.  A standard sized vest will take a yard of material to cover fully......If you are paying $65 for a "kevlar" vest.....YOU AINT GETTING REAL KEVLAR! 

I'm really just sharing some of the conversations I've had over the past few months with new customers......hopefully by reading my rants you will get some helpful information!


Do the math.....

Hundreds of dollars on a dog.
Thousands of dollars in feed and vet maintenance.
Fuel, training, kennels, ect, ect.....

For me the cut gear is by far the cheapest factor in the whole equasion........Buy the best is my policy......I owe that much to my dog!

Up to you to ask around and get feedback and determine in your mind what the best is.

I'm kinda biased!

[pig picker]

Speakin of Cut vests. Cody Is mine in the mail yet?

[Black Gold]

PigPiker,

I'm horrible with putting real names withs screen names.....Im in shop today....please call me. 1-866-307-1999 or 361-772-8023

[L3Outdoors]

Just my two cents. I started out with custom vests made out of leather that looked more like a breast plate over the shoulders. Then I moved on to what ever was on the market at the time, and they all worked well with some added beaf. Tryed several Kevlar and its good stuff, but always left the dogs brused and sore after several hogs in a day. Now I am using short vests that only cover the neck and shoulders. After studying several hours of film of my dogs on hogs, and looking at past vests. I determined that the most hit part on my dogs is the front shoulders and chest. I found very few if any cuts on the rear part of the vests. I fell that the added mobility in the waist of the dog is far more importent than protection of the guts. Some things that I will not hunt WITHOUT are shoulder and leg flaps, jaw flaps, and one piece vest and collar.

[hoghunterdfw]

I APPRECIATE ALL THE WISE INPUT. LOOKS LIKE I WILL WAIT UNTIL MARCH FOR THE GOOD STUFF. THANKS AGAIN FOR THE TIME IN ANSWERING THE QUESTION.

[jhy]

Krystal,

The vest that Catch was wearing last weekend was one of those RP outdoor vests.  He still gets hot in it just like any other vest, however, that vest gives him the best range of motion that I have tried yet.  They offer exceptional protection but I dont think that they will last long because they seem to have fabric stuffed in them, kinda of like quilting, which I think ads more insulation defeating the purpose of the eyelets.  I havent had anything poke through it yet, but I am sure that will change soon.  As for the purpose of the eyelets it my understanding that the vest and dog need to be wet for it too cool the dog by convection.  I have only had one vest that never got cut through and Bib Register made it.  Hoot Gibson took his design but left out some layers.  That vest would stop a .22LR and point blank range.

Joey

[chadrad]

IN MY OPINION....the best cut-vest out there, bar none, is the Devistator from Black Gold. I always walk my catch dogs within 15 yards of the bay before I release and have seen the hits that these vests can take from hogs with long cutters. I have had boars cut through the first layer but never through the second. My bulldogs have streaks of hair missing on their sides from being raked, but the cutter never went through. Just my two cents, but seeing is believing and you get what you pay for.

[TexasHogDogs]

On the heat subject

A lot of folks get bulldogs hot in cut vest in the heat .  I have but very seldom it dont happen often when we are in the tie mode.  One thing I think a lot of people is missing when I say I run my ruff cur dogs in cut vest and have not had much of a problam with heat if any at all is ,  a bulldog packs a lot more heat in his body than most cur dogs do due to the muscle mass and the way they are built  .
I raised bulldogs for years and unless he is in top condition he is gonna run hot even with out a vest in the heat ,  I wont say they all will but 85 - 90 percent will and the other 10-15 percent the reason they dont is either they are in very good conditon are they are built differnt with a longer type of body, legs and muscle style.  Another thing that comes into play with catch dogs being bulldogs is  how they are bred by that I mean inbred will heat up fast, linebred a little slower and they straight out crosses have the best chance of being naturally winded a lot goes into play when you talk about dogs getting over heated.  A bulldog that dont get worked on a regular basics is one that will heat up fast it takes a lot of work to get one in just good condition let alone great condition.  A lot of folks will put a bulldog on his four wheeler and never even take him off till it is time to catch and then during the week when they are not hunting that bulldog will just sit on the end of a chain are in a kennel with no work at all and more than likely he is still sore from the last catch he was on and here they go again on a hunt,  and then people wonder why a catch dog heats up so fast .  Just because a dog looks great on the outside is no indication none what so ever as to what kind of real shape that dog is in rather it be a  Pit Bull, Dogo, American Bulldog are what ever kind of catch dog you use.   I would almost be willing to say that the reason your dog heats up if he does is not because of the vest but because of the real time shape he is really in!  One other thing if he ever quits because of heat you might as well give him away .

TexasHogDogs - Jim

[muleman]

I kind of like the idea of the eyelets. not so much for cooling but it seems they would add another amount of protection. Think about every knife sheath, they all have a brass or metal rivet at the top to keep the blade from cutting the material over time as you put your knife back in. Seems like these rivets would act the same way. I have not seen one of those vests in person but I may order one or just add eyelets to one of the existing vests I have. I think you could go with a bit larger eyelet and get some amount of air flow. It makes sense that something with holes would allow more heat to pass out of it than a solid non breatheable material. I think thats called the law of thermodynamics.

[TexasHogDogs]

Put your vest on your dogs,  this is just a light bay vest but if i would not have had it on my ole blue gyp today she proably would not be here this was a lung shot all the way .  She is fine,  it went thru but only left a slight cut on her also there is another littler hole .  Am sure she is going to be sore from the blow it was a hard one. No broke ribs.

DAMN GLAD I HAD IT ON HER I HAVE LEARN MY LESSONS .

TEXASHOGDOGS-JIM