loosing or quitting ?

[tnhillbilly]

Actually I like both types, if ive got a big place and dont have to go to work I want dogs that wont quit. If ive only got a few hrs to hunt or smaller place I want a dog that wont stick for days.
   But Reuben brings up a good point about how the dogs are handled, I think sometimes we might teach our dogs to have less bottom. Say you go to calling them in everytime they get so far out or so far behind a hog, the dogs learn to quit a bad runner and go find an easier one.
But you have different variables to consider, up here it might take couple hrs just to get to the dogs, so if they aint got enough bottom to stick, and stay bayed for hrs, you aint gonna see much pork.
    I can see both sides, and see how both types work better under certain circumstances.
   But my 1st choice is gritty, "not catchy" dogs that with alot of bottom.
But at the same time, I have seen dogs put on a red hot track, and loose the track, or have it blow up, more than once. My opinion is the dogs just over run the track out of excitement. But a good dog should be able to realize this and circle back and pick it back up, but dont always happen.

[brad s]

Its always good to have a dog that will go all day on boar but I simply don't have the time to chase a dog all day.  I went not long ago with my buddy and his dog will stick with a runner all day long and I had to call in to work that day and still never caught the pig. Had my dogs in the box 3hrs before we got his back. I guess it just depends on the hunter and what they  prefer. Jmo

[SCHitemHard]

id rather have a dog that goes out and checks in, i always hunted small areas so a runner is not a good thing

also most of my dogs were eyesight to short range anyway

[BarrNinja]

Well, I will take a dog that's stays hooked no matter what kind of country I'm hunting and expect them to run a hog to hell and back if they have to. I'm funny like that though.  I will take a 10 pound bass over five 2 pounders also but my plan is always to catch all I can. Same goes for hog hunting with me.

Just because a dog has a ton of bottom doesn't mean it is going to run a hog all over hell and Texas every time he finds one.     
In my book, the right kind of dog will put just the right pressure on a hog to keep it bayed no matter how far it has to run him........if he has to run him at all.

 

[Reuben]

Well, I will take a dog that's stays hooked no matter what kind of country I'm hunting and expect them to run a hog to hell and back if they have to. I'm funny like that though.  I will take a 10 pound bass over five 2 pounders also but my plan is always to catch all I can. Same goes for hog hunting with me.

Just because a dog has a ton of bottom doesn't mean it is going to run a hog all over hell and Texas every time he finds one.     
In my book, the right kind of dog will put just the right pressure on a hog to keep it bayed no matter how far it has to run him........if he has to run him at all.

 

I agree...

I like the idea of adding gritt until the hog gets stopped at the first oppurtune time and expect the dogs to stick until it gets done...the sooner the better...that's the goal...

doesn't happen that way all the time but that is the goal

[halfbreed]

huh must be too sensetive a discussion . all the members on here with all them super dogs with all that bottum everybody talks about i thought it would get more of a response . guess i was wrong or maybe i just got my answer .   

[Mike]

huh must be too sensetive a discussion . all the members on here with all them super dogs with all that bottum everybody talks about i thought it would get more of a response . guess i was wrong or maybe i just got my answer .   

Halfbreed, I don't call those super dogs... I call them hog dogs. I've hunted with several folks on here that have those type dogs, I'm even fortunate to own a couple. After running a hog 5 to 10 miles, 3 to 4 hours or more... who knows if they lost it or quit it? But they get an "A" for effort in my book.

[halfbreed]

     just stirring the pot    

[ole shep]

Ok here goes, I spent they last 20 yrs studying dogs that track coons,cows,deer,rabbits,hogs,drugs,people,biscuits. Ok you get the point, I still can't answer your question.

This is what I did. I found a walker gyp that is the definition of bottom. And added some young plotts. I like me some hound for the nose and noise. Add my partners curs that are hog dogs. Not many get away.we hunt big country with lots of hogs also.

That being said we did not stop a hog the other night. Why? my best guess is no grass or weeds to leave much sent along with some plowed ground and dry weather. But the kicker I think was very low humidity. When you talk to the old hound hunters that know all the good excuses and when you boil it down the thicker the air the better the nose.

OK as far as the Super dogs that will stay on one for several miles and stay bayed till someone comes to them.     It's the same ones as described above.

[Reuben]

Ok here goes, I spent they last 20 yrs studying dogs that track coons,cows,deer,rabbits,hogs,drugs,people,biscuits. Ok you get the point, I still can't answer your question.


That being said we did not stop a hog the other night. Why? my best guess is no grass or weeds to leave much sent along with some plowed ground and dry weather. But the kicker I think was very low humidity. When you talk to the old hound hunters that know all the good excuses and when you boil it down the thicker the air the better the nose.

I was a distillation tech/supervisor in a chemical plant for 32 years. One of the things I learned is low humidity and dry and how it works.


The simplest and easiest way to explain it is low barometric pressure tends to make it easier for evaporation which in my mind would cause the scent to rise or evaporate at a faster rate.

dry weather with low humidity does the same and the lower the humidity the faster the evaporation rate...this will cause the scent to rise and or dissipate. This will also make it for harder trailing conditions...

that is why evaporation makes it feel real nice and cool during low humidity conditions...and as you have noticed we appear to not be sweating. Well, we are sweating but due to low humidity we have a high evaporation rate so that is what gives us the cooling effect. Evaporation carries the heat away from our bodies and the same evaporation carries the scent away and the dogs can not smell the track for the same reasons...Also a winding type dog would not be able to smell what is not there which is scent that has risen over his head/nose. It is possible for a dog to wind the game if the wind is strong enough to sweep the scent along the ground. I think this is why some dogs are running the hog about 50 yards behind in the thick briars and on the down and crosswind side of the hog because they are running off the scent in the wind, this is when there is a good crosswind.

When the humidity is high we sweat quite a bit and we can't seem to cool because of not having the evaporation to carry off the heat. The same reason for tracking and winding. The scent tends to stay in the track longer due to less evaporation so the dogs can trail and wind better.

In my opinion a dog can wind better and for a longer range when the conditions are right for winding. I believe the humidity has to be somewhat low for evaporation to occur and a good wind to carry the scent closer to the ground and somewhat cooler weather to help keep the scent low as well as a higher barometric pressure...not all of these have to apply but I am talking about optimim winding conditions.

These are all my theoretical bull hocky idea's... but like I used to tell the engineers at work...since no one here knows the answer my theories are fact until you can prove them otherwise...  

[jdt]

this has been a good thread ! rueben , thank you , you have made my day , now i can back up all dogs mistakes 

[ole shep]

That's interesting because that night we got cold.I think the humidity was like 38%.  Hot day cold night.  Desert conditions

[BigCutters4]

I agree with Chris and HalfBreed...

can't stop what the dogs can't catch up to. But I like a dog that when he catches up to do all he can to stop the hog. The goal is to breed better dogs that can stop a hog as quick as possible...But at the same time have the bottom to run for hours as needed.

A dog that runs for hours as needed is a dog that will make you worry and possibly get you in trouble. I have wrestled with this for many years...I like grit and I like for the dog to stick until he catches what is on the other end of the tracks...ain't sayin we will catch all but that is the goal.

So if I like all that bottom and stick, and a dog that can stop a hog then it makes sense to breed rough dogs...a rough dog that will go as far as needed but will stop the hog the first chance he gets...

might be wrong but that is how I see it...I just don't care for a dog that quits a track and looks for an easier hog to catch...that is a cull in my book...

OH ???and then when the dog is to gritty and makes the hog bay I get conused and wonder if loose baying is better.......I have wrestled with that one too but have decided rougher until it works...

am I confused or what?              

              MAN IN MY BOOK YA HIT THE NAIL ONE THE HEAD YOU MUST BE A MIND READER

[Caseydejohn]

I never say much on here but i keep up with the board.
 
There is a big difference between a dog that wants to run a hog and stop a hog. Not saying they have to catch it just pinch here and bite there. I cant stand a rough dog but love a gritty dog.

People that are happy with heart less dogs are the reason its so hard to find a good line of dogs any more. If a dogs quits a hog alot he aint going to be on my feed bill...

[halfbreed]

hell i knew stirring the pot would wake yall up    thats what i was lookin for in this topic anyway . you know good nights verses bad nights and weather and ground conditions as a factor . hell i been talkin to my friend in arizona about getting some dry ground cat hound blood being as it looks like it may never rain again here in east texas . funny how they can work and jump an ol cat after hours of cold trailin in some of the worst cond. i've ever seen .

[BigCutters4]

hell i knew stirring the pot would wake yall up    thats what i was lookin for in this topic anyway . you know good nights verses bad nights and weather and ground conditions as a factor . hell i been talkin to my friend in arizona about getting some dry ground cat hound blood being as it looks like it may never rain again here in east texas . funny how they can work and jump an ol cat after hours of cold trailin in some of the worst cond. i've ever seen .

what kind of dogs they run for them cats are they ruff -gritty -catchy or what ever ya wanna call it these days

[halfbreed]

from what they tell me it's mostly a blen of walker dogs alot of them are red and white probley some blood hound in em like the majestics they run to catch and kill or tree . alot of em don't make it kinda like hog huntin . thats one of the things on my bucket list yet to do personally i ain't been yet but a friend of mine knows a bunch of them boy's . his granpa used to be a gov. hunter . i met him in 1973 when in usmc and we became friends right off after he showed me a picture of him with a jaguar sittin in his lap that was killed on the ariz/ mex border . that cat must of wieghed 200 lbs

[BigCutters4]

from what they tell me it's mostly a blen of walker dogs alot of them are red and white probley some blood hound in em like the majestics they run to catch and kill or tree . alot of em don't make it kinda like hog huntin . thats one of the things on my bucket list yet to do personally i ain't been yet but a friend of mine knows a bunch of them boy's . his granpa used to be a gov. hunter . i met him in 1973 when in usmc and we became friends right off after he showed me a picture of him with a jaguar sittin in his lap that was killed on the ariz/ mex border . that cat must of wieghed 200 lbs

wow thats good stuff

[TColt]

I been huntin a new part of the country due to a temporary move and all we got here is runners. Seems to me the only thing we get is the crack head echisketch. We have also had two boars that my lacy dog struck and soon as we got close for one of the other dogs (dogs in training basically) to go to her, the hog breaks right when they get there, does a loop, then comes back and tries to hunt us down. Both these boars ran strait through our groupe, one of them got my buddy, Zach, in the leg then he did the echisketch in about a two mile diameter around us for four and a half hours before I started callin lacy back, the other did the same thing to me but I got out the way and started callin her back right away and called it a night.

One thing I have noticed is when my buddies dogs fell out quick, it was dogsthat ain't gettin off the chain but about once a week. which might be the same issue alot of other people are having. It's not that the dogs ain't good or don't have bottom, but that the dogs ain't legged up and ready to hunt to their full potential. Heck, one of the dogs that fell out a couple times was a plot hound. And from the ones I seen, that breed in general has some bottom. But it's hard to run a marathon when you been sittin on your rear end not training for it.

I'm not doggin on people that don't have there dogs legged up and are losing pigs cuz of it. I know people got jobs and school and whatnot, me and all my buddies are students so I don't complain when we can't get my lacy dog some help. But in my opinion, hog dogs are like anything in life, you get out of them what you put in them. If I don't get a chance to hunt, I'll hit some back roads for a couple hours and make the dogs run with the truck a couple times a week cd included, and I don't ever have a problem with my dogs stickin to pigs, my dogs just have a problem with me not havin enough bottom haha!

[firemedic]

That's interesting because that night we got cold.I think the humidity was like 38%.  Hot day cold night.  Desert conditions

I don't think the humidity has ever been 38% here.....most days it's closer to 138%.