"Blue" Lacy

[Lacy man]

I had a lacy given to me a few years back and that thing was as wild and skiddish as a coyote... Based on what I saw in that dog, I believe they did originate from coyotes... 

That dog also meet the same fate as many coyotes

Key word given to you. I haven't had any issues with my 2 lacys

[Lacy man]

Sometimes but not always ppl give a dog away, because they don't want it on their yard for more than one reason. Then there a good ppl that want a good pup to go to a good huntin home. And will give it to a friend. So maybe the dog didn't make it on someone's yard and that's how your ended up with it? Maybe it should have been just a cull like I stated neither of my lacys have issues

[ole shep]

My opinions:
35 years ago a man name Ed Miller gave me a Lacy dog told me put her with my cow dogs and try her. Said she would last longer and be in the front. I told him i would but she was so damn ugly and inbred she probably would not work out for me.I called her " RAT" for 13 years she was a cow working machine.I did not know how inbred she was as I had only seen one other lacy and he looked nothing like her.

Lacy number 2 was bought 20 yrs later pretty good all around dog.Not anything like "The Rat"  She was a smart dog and would work cows,bay pigs and find wounded game.

I became a breeder would raise about 1 litter every year or two tryed my best to send them were they had to work for a living.
Ended up selling a couple of finished tracking dogs for big money.Still have pups from one now could not register because bred a little tight.

I am the prime example of what some of yalls discussions are about.As i got older I decided to hunt more and catch less [hmmm intersting]
So I went to hunting dogs instead of stock dogs. I have always liked Plotts I even worked cows with some. But I dont think a hound will equal a stock dog in producing hogs in country that has LOTS of pigs. Nor will stock dog equal a hunting  hound at finding pigs in hard country.

I have been around hunting dogs for 53 years and the most impressive hunting dogs i can remember were my dads bird dogs. If you were hunting and thought man there should be a covey over there you can bet they would check it and have the wind on it when they did. I also remember hungry pups not eating because 13 were on point at the flys on the feed. Now that my friends is a HUNTING DOG!!

[Wmwendler]

Looks like we got pretty far off track while I was at work.


Does anyone who beleives the Lacy dogs have wolf/coyote or greyhound in them wanna comment on the fact that the oldest known, and therefore most historically significant article which discusses the Lacy dogs origin says nothing about wolves, coyotes or greyhounds?

Also none of those dogs posessed the instinct to lead out, or work the front of livestock.  Which is a common trait of Lacys and stock working Cur dogs.  Where might you suggest that came from?

I know one potential source that was available at the time.

Waylon

[Purebreedcolt]

All I know is my dad grew up south of mason and had lacys as long as he could remember always said they were yote grey hound and some hound.  This is before there was the tgla etc.  Waylon I have to ask how many lacys have you owned.  Hounds typically work to the front so there you go.  Now I don't doubt that the starting breed was a cur dog but a lacy is a lot different than a cur dog to me they act like a yote more than a cur dog.

[Wmwendler]

So your saying that hounds if put on a group of cows would typically lead out and take them to the Lot?

[Purebreedcolt]

I would imagine with the right selecting yeah it could be done.  Would the be the best no probally not could you selectively breed for a 120 years and get some durn good stock hounds yeah probably so.  Back to my question how many lacys have you owned?

[t.wilbanks]

I had a lacy given to me a few years back and that thing was as wild and skiddish as a coyote... Based on what I saw in that dog, I believe they did originate from coyotes... 

That dog also meet the same fate as many coyotes

Key word given to you. I haven't had any issues with my 2 lacys

Yeah, she would have been so much better if I would have paid for her.... 

My post was just a joke and she was for sure a cull, and I haven't seen many other full blood Lacey's hunt or work..

I guess I should have taken to her to the woods and left her... Hopefully her bred instincts would have taken over and she fell in with a pack of coyotes... Blue coyotes would have been pretty cool!! 

[Purebreedcolt]

And I don't know about yall but half of the lacys I have been around like nipping the back and making a hog spin especially when there is more than one dog. Now not all do this but I would say half or so that I have owned or been around.  My male works the head but my female now has tendencys to work the back end of a hog especially when there is more than one dog with her.

[Lacy man]

I had a lacy given to me a few years back and that thing was as wild and skiddish as a coyote... Based on what I saw in that dog, I believe they did originate from coyotes... 

That dog also meet the same fate as many coyotes

Key word given to you. I haven't had any issues with my 2 lacys

Yeah, she would have been so much better if I would have paid for her.... 

My post was just a joke and she was for sure a cull, and I haven't seen many other full blood Lacey's hunt or work..

I guess I should have taken to her to the woods and left her... Hopefully her bred instincts would have taken over and she fell in with a pack of coyotes... Blue coyotes would have been pretty cool!! 

Lol didn't mean for it to come across like that. And no I don't think you need to buy one for it to be a good one. Hell I plan on giving a pup away to a guy that I know very well and if I thought it was going to be a cull he dang sure wouldn't get It. No one would.

[Lacy man]

Blue yotes would be cool lol

[halfbreed]

hell when it comes to origins be it dog or man there are alot of tall tales involved . but i find it hard to wrap my noggin around the fact of intintionally breeding to a wolf or coyote while all the while trying to eradicate the species off the face of the earth but who knows . sure ain't nothin to fuss and frett over thats for sure . hell when i was a child i used to tell everybody my ol collie dog was part wolf  lol

[cantexduck]

  I started hunting with some lacy people. Have seen dogs from all the large breeders in the state.  The one really good one I saw came from an old guy in the hill country. Not reg and line bred. Dog was never able to reproduce himself after a lot of trys. I will hunt any breed of dog, have yet to see any lacy dogs I would want. The two groups love to hate one another. Very few of the breeders hunt their dogs like we do. Most that I have seen are short range and rough.
  Oh, a dog that has wolf/coyote in it? I want one, how much?- Great selling point. I have no clue what is in the dog but breeding a wolf/yote into a dog seems strange.
  Talking lacy dogs is a lot like talking Ben bred dogs. People always get pissed off.

[Lacy man]

Shoot I ll be the first to say my dogs aren't perfect, and I hunt them as physically possible but hell I m not perfect either. I like mine, and they hunt well for me, and I ll breed em when see fit and if they don't work they be culled. That's how I d be with any breed Of dog i own though.

[Wmwendler]

I would imagine with the right selecting yeah it could be done.  Would the be the best no probally not could you selectively breed for a 120 years and get some durn good stock hounds yeah probably so.  Back to my question how many lacys have you owned?

None, I've seen plenty of them working though.....How many coyotes have you tried to raise and breed?

Waylon

[Wmwendler]

Again....this is not a thread about weather or not Lacy dogs make good hunting or working dogs.  It will turn into nothing but an ego match if that was the topic.  If I see the thread continue to go in that direction I will request it get deleted.  This is about the origin of the breed and what dogs went into the making of them, and the documentation to support it.

Waylon

[Lacy man]

Again....this is not a thread about weather or not Lacy dogs make good hunting or working dogs.  It will turn into nothing but an ego match if that was the topic.  If I see the thread continue to go in that direction I will request it get deleted.  This is about the origin of the breed and what dogs went into the making of them, and the documentation to support it.

Waylon

Well I don't think there is really any documentation other than wise tells and older owners and what they had/heard of what the dog came from just like any
Other dogs. As you stated the Nlda has some back ground history in old
Newspaper articles, documentation, so on and so forth. Other than that it's a crap shoot just like the rest Of the dogs we all own.

[Lacy man]

I didn't mean to say no documentation, more like very limited. But as I stated it all comes from wise tells

[cantexduck]

 I doubt anyone can prove other then what they heard makes up the dog. The more you think about it the less it makes sense in adding yote or wolf blood.

[Bryant]

I've always been a bit curious about this...

If memory serves me correctly, is there one of the registries that will not accept registrations for dogs that have been linebred?

With that in mind, how do you ever "start" a breed of dog and get to the point of them breeding true to type without linebreeding / inbreeding them?  In my mind, it's virtually impossible.