Few thoughts on the cow dog/hog dog correlation....

[parker]

how  many  cowdogs  you  see with tracking  collars  on .....not  trying  to  make  anyone mad ....everybody  loves  what they  have ..... handle  is  the  last thing  i worry a bout .... i  have  to  have a  dog  that hunts .....  i mean  hunts ...... a  cow  is  a  hundred  times  easier  to  find  than a  hog ...... i  have a  good  friend  of  mine  that  is a  well know  cowdog  person ....he has  been  on  front  of   cowdog  magezines  and  has  and  does  own  some  real  cowdogs  he can  call  off  set  on  other  cattle  or  whatever .......but  he  quit  bringing  them  hoghunting  ........pasture  dogs ....just  didn;t  have  the  track  down hunt a  real good  hogdog  does ...... for  my  money  mountain  cur  crosses  i like  the  best.......takes  way  more  brains  to  go  hit a  coon  track and  run it  for a  mile  off 3  hour  old scent  and  put  it  in the  right tree ...... game  finders ..... its  each  to  his  own ..... and s ome  cowdogs  make  real good  hogdogs ....but  working cattle  and  finding a  boar  hog  off a  single  track 4  hours  old laid  up in a  cutover  half a  mile  off  is a  different  world .....

[Wmwendler]

Circle C....They are pretty much all related in some way or another.  That Brindle one is a gyp and full litter mate to Lana....also have a male from that litter and the Dog they are out of, they are in Dads yard.  I told him I needed the male litter mate and he had too many dogs anyway.... but no luck .  The solid black dog in the bottom pic is related also goes back to a grand dam....not mine but same breeding and just wanted to show the build.  The Black and tan is from cow dog stock and could be related to lana as both have relatives from the same yard, but just dont know if they matched up, but they share some of the same blood.

Waylon

[craig]

parker
  thats the reason we dont all drive the same kinda trucks, wear the same kinda boots.

 that why we do this to find out everyone else's veiws,  who knows we might learn something .

  thanks for the input

[Circle C]

Waylon,
  Lana pulled one out of the hat today for Harry. Really nice boar hog, maybe he will post some pictures when he gets back in town.

[cward]

Hello Mr parker herd alot about your dogs even looked on your sight at your dogs very nice.Seen one of your dogs hear around my area.   But in the picture of my yellow gyp she has a tracking collar on when theses dogs leave they leave in the story this gyp was bayed on the  9 head and 3 more dogs were bayed on 11 head that day we had to track to them when I go hunt for cows I hunt.when we go hunt we might look in 15000 acres for 20 head  2 or three might be together.I'm am usally called after all the pets are gone.I have tied cows like hogs in the woods.I catch lots of hogs with the same dogs.They will take a track and trail it.like I said I have seen dogs better than my mine but I just like a handle. I do not belieave you should have to leash a dog after catching a hog they better get on.Gentics  works good for me.Just like it works good for you.Some of the cows I hunt you better be a cowboy and you better have a good dog and you better be sitten on a real horse.

[cward]

Noah if you are ever in the southeast texas area stop by and we will go make around I have plenty of place's to hunt mostly ranch's but we catch and tie every thing but your more than welcome to come and go.and bring your dogs.And yes I love what I do would not change it for anything I have a son named cattle this is are life style.

[chancebrown]

my cowdog is good  on hogs to but... he will run cows if your in a place that has them until you call him off. so therefore he is only used as a cowdog

[Noah]

Thanks cward, honestly, I'd rather just come catch cattle with you... but I guess we could mess with a hog after we ran out of daylight.

I've actually been playing around with the idea of putting my older hog dogs on cattle, now that they're completely broke off them(see if I can really screw 'em up  ).... no sense in having two sets of dogs when you can just train on 'em a little harder

[cward]

That's Right !!!!!!!

[parker]

cward  i'm  sure  you  have  some  very  nice  dogs ...... i  have  penned  quite a  few  cattle  myself .....have  rode  miles gathering  fence  breakers ..... roped  dragged  and  tied  cattle  in the  woods  too ......  but  i  still  haven't  seen  very  many  cowdogs  that  will  get down and  hunt a  hog  like a good  hogdog .....  the  places  i hunt  would  just  be a  different  world  than  what  most  cattle  dogs  are  used  too ..... it  whatever a  person  likes ...

[dabutcher]

well, i'll say this much about Chance's (cward) dogs.  they're for REAL hog dogs for dang sure.  i had the pleasure of hunting with him and a partner of his.  they work real hard and definitely have a good handle. 

i'd feed em any day of the week.....

[crackerc]

I just had to put in my thought on this topic too. I have managed ranches here in Fla for 13 years, the last ranch we ran 500 cow/calf pairs on thousands of acres. Some pasture, but some was rough woods too. I have been raising the same line of dogs I have now for about 26 years and have used the same line on both hogs and cows with success. Our cow dogs usually couldn't see the cattle they had to wind thema nd bay them up. And yes a 100 head of cattle are a lot easier to wind that one hog in a briar patch but the drive to find them still has to be there.

I rarely used the same dogs on cows and hogs but may use littermates. When I go to pen cows I don't want my dogs to get off on a hog and mess up a days work. And when I am hog hunting they better not mess witha  cow.....

That said I know what Larry is talking about. My dogs won't have the range his will but are bred to hunt closer and have more handle. I will be 50 years old in August and I personally don't want a dog that will go 5 miles to find a hog. The hunting places here in Fla keep getting smaller and I need a dog that hunts with me, not one that hunts like a hound and goes and goes. But for the way Larry hunts, his dogs are ideal for him.
I feel Larry definately has a good breeding program and his dogs have their place.

If I had huge tracts to hunt, ((and was maybe younger...LOL) I would have to try one of Larry's dogs just so I could see what they do in the woods, having never actually hunted with a Parker cur.

But I hunt places that are 1,000 -3,000 acres and my dogs get off of those places regularly so I know I don't want anything longer ranged than what I have. My dogs are medium range, medium nosed dogs with a lot of speed, a head full of sense, and run to stop, whether its a cow or hog. They are not going to run along and boo hoo bark at something, like some of the cow dogs I have seen, I can tell you that...

BTW good looking dog cward!!

[Wmwendler]

Waylon,
  Lana pulled one out of the hat today for Harry. Really nice boar hog, maybe he will post some pictures when he gets back in town.

U sure she did'nt pull him out of a thickett?  Tell him to post it if he can I'd like to see it.

Waylon

[Eric]

Good posts Waylon and Silverton. I couldn't agree more.

I will take cow dog pups over hog dog pups any day. Cheaper, smarter, higher probability of them turning out. Too many hog hunters keep dogs out of pride or pitty. When some one makes a living working cattle, you can bet they are probably using the best they can find.

This works for me, in my area, and my situation. Not claiming any thing more... 

[joe]

just my short experinced opinion, but from what i have seen in the few places that i have hunted that has hogs and cows, they bay up differently. it seems to me that when hogs get busted up, most of them go into everyman for his own mode, some stick together some go one way and keep going and some kind of duck off to the side and hide. i have seen them bunch up together but not often. so wouldnt it take a bad dog to be able to bunch a group of hogs and keep them together. now i am talking about places that get dogged often and maybe the hogs have it figured out and the cows know they have a better chance of saving their young if they stick together. so i see what your saying noah, different dog for a different but similar job.

[Pecos21]

I think there is some misunderstanding of what a cowdog does. There is no real differance in how I use a dog to hunt cattle and how I use the same dog to hunt hogs. My dogs do not ever drive cattle, there job is to hunt , track or wind cattle. They need to stop them and put them in a bunch and hold them at bay untill I get to them. A good cow dog needs to be smarter than the average hog dog and have way more handle.

Paul T

I am gonna have to say AMEN to this!!!!!! I have caught and tied CATTLE in the same swamps I have caught and tied HOGS!!!! The difference is usually only about 600-900 lbs. I am not sure where most of you have seen cow dogs work...NALC competitions don't constitute a dog being a cow dog.....I have used my cowdogs in Florida and South Georgia swamps and North Georgia Mountains.....I know LOTS of hog dogs that wouldn't cut it baying and catching cattle. 

[Wmwendler]

it seems to me that when hogs get busted up, most of them go into everyman for his own mode, some stick together some go one way and keep going and some kind of duck off to the side and hide. i have seen them bunch up together but not often.

Cows will do that too if you treat them the wrong way. 
My dad leased a ranch years back and baught the cattle with it.....actually 3000 acres of brush and not much pasture.  The previous leese (the guy we bought the cattle from), well lets just say his replacement heifers were the ones he could not catch.  This is what the guy said I'll sell you the gentle cattle and there are a few wild ones that u can't catch and you can have those.  The deer and coyotes on this place weren't as wild as some of the cattle.  We had the place leased for 6 years and during that time dad made a point to get rid of any real wild cattle that got penned or caught.  We trapped a few, roped some and usually would get a couple to the lot every time we penned.  That being said when the place was sold and dads lease was up we penned the majority of the cattle and there were still about a dozen of those snakes left, some of which dad had never even seen.  All of which had to be hunted one at a time and roped.  Turn loose on fresh tracks and start hunting.  Work like that is where cow dogs are proven and cow dog stock that does work like that will produce excellent hog dogs.  Just my 2 cents.

Waylon

Waylon

[WestTexasCurs]

I am gonna have to go with Parker.I have used lots of dogs on cattle,and didnt like them on hogs.I want my hog dogs to go find me a hog.I dont want them looking me in the eye,I want them to go till they find one.I want a colder nosed dog ,that can take a older track,than what most cow dogs will.When someone says cowdog around me I think Blackmouth Curs,Catahoulas etc.Although,I have seen some Kelpies that were damn hard to beat on cows.When someone says hunting dog I think Mountain Curs,Plotts,Hounds.I know that there are some great Blackmouth hog dogs,and Catahoulas etc.To me it all boils down to what you like in a dog.Great topic.

[bigo]

There is a small hand full of dogs and places around where you can put a dog on a day old cow track and ride till you find them, which might be the next day. The closing of open range and small improved pastures about made them extinct, but they do exist. They find and bay hogs the way I like, if they are in a bunch keep them bunched, if its a single and standing still back up and bay, if it runs stop it then back up and bay. They also hunt as wide and hard as most hounds and do not lack nose.

[WestTexasCurs]

I have heard of those Blackmouth dogs.Sound like great dogs to me.Yall are lucky to have them.