KENNEL BLINDNESS

[justincorbell]

........SOooo I have a hunting buddy that was invited to hunt with another fella a while back, the fella's he went with talk as though they have some great dogs and are actually breeding one of them............ I was not on the hunt but it just struck me a pretty funny that my buddies tells me that his YOUNG puppy he brought left out and out hunted the "strike dogs" to the point that it made em look silly.........I'm talkin a 8mth old gyp hunting 4-600yds in the woods nonstop while the "strike dogs" stayed on the road pretty much the entire hunt.......... I'm not bringing this up to start an arguement.........I'm bringing it up to talk about the ever prevelant issue of "kennel blindness" in the sport we all enjoy so much..........

My questions for you, ETHD, are as follows.......

Put your self in this situation..........At what point do you, or do you ever bring up the breeding of sub-par dogs to someone to possibly prevent the breeding of more subpar dogs? OR do you leave it alone, not say anything and not worry about it because they ain't your dogs and you aren't feeding them? I guess ultimately what I'm asking is that if YOU don't think that a breeding should take place do you open your mouth or just leave it alone???............we all talk about the downfall of a breed being due to the fact that sub-par dogs are bred when they shouldn't be BUT what has anyone done to try to prevent such a breeding..........to me it is a loose loose situation because if you don't say something when you know it shouldn't happen then you aren't helping the cause BUT if you DO say something then odd's are you are going to hurt someones feelings and get em all pissy with you for talkin bad about their beloved culls.......SO how do you personally handle it???

I know full well that this is a touchy subject and people are very quick to get ticked off about others judging their dogs......Hell I know a guy that doesn't have a single dog in his yard that I wouldn't cull BUT he is the 1st to talk about bloodline this and so and so's  that and will make little snide remarks insinuating that the junk he has is better because the parents are built better and hunt "the way he wants" and on and on and on BUT his dogs don't do chit ..........I sit back and laugh to myself pretty much the entire time listening to this nonsense while my old mutts roll on. Figured it was high time for another fun debate.

[Bryant]

First off, you have to keep in mind that everyone's expectations and likes/dislikes in a dog is a bit different.  I'm always a bit leary of any breeder who claims to produce dogs that will suit everyone.  What one person likes, another hates.  For example...I enjoy hunting the dogs I breed and raise which are very independant, hunt for themselves, rangy type dogs.  For others with smaller properties, or those who prefer to road their dogs they would hate the very qualities that I find desirable and demand from my breedings.

I've hunted with many people over the years who were very proud of their packs, yet they wouldn't necessarily fit my personal style of hunting.  Having said that, If they're happy and catching hogs who am I to say they are doing it wrong.

Another analogy...just because I don't like Dodge trucks, doesn't mean I think they should quit making them.  See where I'm coming from?

Now, when someone starts breeding dogs and representing them as something they are not in order to make a sale...that's when trouble arises.

[justincorbell]

First off, you have to keep in mind that everyone's expectations and likes/dislikes in a dog is a bit different.  I'm always a bit leary of any breeder who claims to produce dogs that will suit everyone.  What one person likes, another hates.  For example...I enjoy hunting the dogs I breed and raise which are very independant, hunt for themselves, rangy type dogs.  For others with smaller properties, or those who prefer to road their dogs they would hate the very qualities that I find desirable and demand from my breedings.

I've hunted with many people over the years who were very proud of their packs, yet they wouldn't necessarily fit my personal style of hunting.  Having said that, If they're happy and catching hogs who am I to say they are doing it wrong.

Another analogy...just because I don't like Dodge trucks, doesn't mean I think they should quit making them.  See where I'm coming from?

Now, when someone starts breeding dogs and representing them as something they are not in order to make a sale...that's when trouble arises.

very good post! and your dodge analogy makes perfect sense, this isn't directed at ANYONE in particular, it has been a re-occuring thing through the years and its something that I have always wondered about.

My personal outlook is pretty straightforward. I hunt with a very small group of people, I can name my regular hunting buddies on 1 hand and I can name the number of people I have hunted with in the last year on probly 2 hands. I tend to shy away from hunting much outside this core group because in the last couple years I have heard some horror stories regarding buddies being invited on hunts just to find out after the hunt.......possibly days or weeks later that the land they were invited to hunt wasn't legally hunted. Now with that said, If any of my close hunting partners ask my opinion on a dog I tell them my honest opinion, if they don't ask then I keep my mouth shut........talkin about a mans dogs can be as touchy as talkin about a mans or womans significant other and can end up bad in no time and I don't want to upset my buddies, I hunt with them because I like being in the woods with them and we have a good time pretty much everytime not because I need or have to hunt with em. Just wondering what angle other people take on the subject.

[halfbreed]

     how does that hank jr. song go   [   MIND YOUR OWN BIZZNEZZ   ]     lol  just like was said everybody's expectations are different , what's good for the goose the gander can't stand .  if your breeding good dogs that you like and hunt with the   [ breed ]  may suffer just as well in somebody else's eyes  .

[TexasHogDogs]

Did they get any hogs that day ?

One time hunting with a mans dogs sometimes dont tell you much if there is no hogs on the proptery .  I have seen my dogs at times make more than some rounds and then come back only to hang around and look at me like I was crazy and it never fails if we keep on hunting and I force them to get out and hunt anyway we never end up with a hog because some how they knew there was no hogs there .   Dogs are smarter than humans in a lot of ways and that is one of them if they are really good dogs.  The thing about it and it has happened many many times we would pack up and leave that proptery and go to another and they would blow out of the box be gone and stay gone the next thing you know they are treed and we have hogs and more hogs .

Just saying dont know what the deal was maybe no hogs there and the older dogs knew it .  I have seen young dogs not finished and not still drilled in there heads what they are really hunting they would be gone hunt and hunt all the while the older dogs would be looking at me like I was crazy saying what are you doing listening to him he is a young punk lets get the hell out of here there is noting here .  I have seen this way more than once in some of my young dogs that wanta go go go .

Then again it could be like you say and the other dogs were just hunks of junk . Hard to say without knowing the dogs and the situation .

[YELLOWBLACKMASK]

If they are close friends ......I would hope they would not be insulted but rather greatful to for speaking your mind on a dogs faults.

If they are outsiders or just acquaintances ......I feel it isn't my place to render judgment. Who knows....the very quality that is highly sought after in our camp  could possibly be their culling factor.  

At the end of the day I am....and always will be a firm believer in breeding best to the best unless your down to the last of that particular bloodline.   Anything else and your just fishing without bait in the gene pool.  

[LoftinCattleCo]

I believe it's personal opinion... I only hunt with a handful of ppl that hunt similar to myself... My old dog will road hunt you can cast him do whatever he will produce you some bacon not fast but plenty fast for me..I have 2 dogs 2y/o and 5 y/o that I wasn't able to start like I needed to due to me workin outta town 12months outta the year.. So when my buddy who has a 7month and 10month old pups come an hunt with me his pups that are hunted 6 days a week are gonna produce and show better than mine which are lucky to get hunted once a week.... Yes I'd like to have better dogs but my strand fit me well and produce enough for me so I'm happy

[justincorbell]

     how does that hank jr. song go   [   MIND YOUR OWN BIZZNEZZ   ]     lol  just like was said everybody's expectations are different , what's good for the goose the gander can't stand .  if your breeding good dogs that you like and hunt with the   [ breed ]  may suffer just as well in somebody else's eyes  .

I agree with you Mr. Whitten but at the same time, doesn't it seem funny that on one hand we as a whole try to preach or at least follow the breeding the best to the best to attempt to breed better dogs but when people breed for reasons other than performance its no big deal........... I reckon as long as dogs are bred this will be part of it........I guess at the end of the day if the guy that is feeding them is happy with em thats all that really matters, thats what its all about anyway, enjoying the sport. Like I said before, im not trying to start a big pissing match in any way and if this happens to turn into one I will quit posting, just like hearing different peoples outlooks regarding what I call "kennel blindness".

[justincorbell]

Did they get any hogs that day ?

One time hunting with a mans dogs sometimes dont tell you much if there is no hogs on the proptery .  I have seen my dogs at times make more than some rounds and then come back only to hang around and look at me like I was crazy and it never fails if we keep on hunting and I force them to get out and hunt anyway we never end up with a hog because some how they knew there was no hogs there .   Dogs are smarter than humans in a lot of ways and that is one of them if they are really good dogs.  The thing about it and it has happened many many times we would pack up and leave that proptery and go to another and they would blow out of the box be gone and stay gone the next thing you know they are treed and we have hogs and more hogs .

Just saying dont know what the deal was maybe no hogs there and the older dogs knew it .  I have seen young dogs not finished and not still drilled in there heads what they are really hunting they would be gone hunt and hunt all the while the older dogs would be looking at me like I was crazy saying what are you doing listening to him he is a young punk lets get the hell out of here there is noting here .  I have seen this way more than once in some of my young dogs that wanta go go go .

Then again it could be like you say and the other dogs were just hunks of junk . Hard to say without knowing the dogs and the situation .

a lot of good points you bring up. thanks for posting, i enjoy looking at and discussing different aspects of a certain  scenerio.......

[halfbreed]

  that's the deal Justin  we as the collective preach and put on revivals and sermons on the mount , but at the end of the day all we can do is to go home and realize that we can't save the world and it boils down to just  the .
                                                            I , ME AND MINE  .

[Peachcreek]

If it doesnt directly affect me i try to leave it alone. I know the situation u r talking about justin but as said above there were indeed no hogs. I witnessed two what i consider good to great dogs not hunt at all on a place last weekend. We went to another place later that day and they hunted their ars off and found two hogs within five minutes. It is like they knew the first place had no hogs on it.

[justincorbell]

If it doesnt directly affect me i try to leave it alone. I know the situation u r talking about justin but as said above there were indeed no hogs. I witnessed two what i consider good to great dogs not hunt at all on a place last weekend. We went to another place later that day and they hunted their ars off and found two hogs within five minutes. It is like they knew the first place had no hogs on it.

Yessir, them dogs are smarter than we give em credit for sometimes.........

[cantexduck]

  Everyone on the internet has good dogs , you know that Justin .
    In my opinion dogs are way over bred. I have kennel blindness the other way. I have yet to own a dog I want to breed. I couod care less about breeding average dogs. 
     People like to say their line , my blood , etc.

[Scott]

Who am I to tell another man/woman what to do with their posessions?

I just look at it as a learning experience. I learn who I would want a dog from and who I wouldn't. As previously stated, my dogs won't suit everyone, just as some have dogs that won't suit me....

[justincorbell]

Who am I to tell another man/woman what to do with their posessions?

I just look at it as a learning experience. I learn who I would want a dog from and who I wouldn't. As previously stated, my dogs won't suit everyone, just as some have dogs that won't suit me....

Well said sir BUT at the same time at the end of the day i do believe a cull is a cull no matter the breed or location

[TexasHogDogs]

If it doesnt directly affect me i try to leave it alone. I know the situation u r talking about justin but as said above there were indeed no hogs. I witnessed two what i consider good to great dogs not hunt at all on a place last weekend. We went to another place later that day and they hunted their ars off and found two hogs within five minutes. It is like they knew the first place had no hogs on it.

There you go man ! Perfect Advise ! Perfectly said !

[Easttex91]

Could it be a difference in hunting styles? If it's who I'm thinking one roads his dogs and the other casts?

[Lacy man]

Could it be a difference in hunting styles? If it's who I'm thinking one roads his dogs and the other casts?

It's not anyone in specific he said that in the above post, he said in general experience.

[KevinN]

I'm more apt to keep my mouth

It just doesn't really matter to ME what people breed. If I do my job (research/homework) when I buy a new pup/dog then im probably gonna be ok. If I don't then I may get screwed. That simple.

[justincorbell]

I'm more apt to keep my mouth

It just doesn't really matter to ME what people breed. If I do my job (research/homework) when I buy a new pup/dog then im probably gonna be ok. If I don't then I may get screwed. That simple.

That pretty well sums it up!