Safer or the same -- catching and shooting over a bay?

[TrueBlueLacys]

OK, since my question sorta got lost in the midst of my total frustration in the last thread here's the serious question...

Do you think there is any difference in injury to the bay dogs between using a lead-in catch dog versus baying and shooting?

We don't use running catch dogs, our dogs are bayed solid before we ever unclip the pits, who hit on an ear and hunker down. The dogs don't have to bay and wait for us to line up a shot.  They aren't at risk from a stray bullet. I'm not saying that baying and shooting is worse, but in my opinion it is no safer for the bay dogs. Dogs are gonna get cut whether you have a gun or a pit. Correct? But I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on this.

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

Leave the bullets at home.  Too many bad things can happen.  Bone can exit a hog and become a projectile.  TOO MANY BAD THINGS TO HAPPEN AROUND MY DOGS!!!!!!!!!!  If they are your dogs, than by all means bring the bullets.  That is how I view it.  I don't want my stuff killed because someone gets excited.

JMO

[cantexduck]

 Bay and Shoot.
    Dogs bay. Hunter shoots. Dead pig. Safe in my mind. I have only shot and killed 7 or so hogs with my dogs but I have never worried about hitting one of them. You arnt shooting from 80yards. And if you have to work too hard at getting a clear shot your dogs shouldnt be getting shot over in the first place.

When the bulldog hits the pigs the dogs catch with them. That is when I think most cuts happen. When the hog is shot it drops. End of story. Your friend out near me(TG) shoots over his dogs. It has worked for him.
  We have hit hogs with 30carbines,7mm and 30-30 and havent had a problem when them being alive when they hit the dirt. I like dropping bulldogs thats why I dont shoot over the dogs much. But when I am alone I will bring the gun. I feel that shooting over the dogs is mroe safe then using catchdogs.

[TRAPPERJOHN29]

ouch that was a low blow!! try to keep the gloves up!! lol

[TrueBlueLacys]

Savoy, I understand the reasoning with the other dogs catching, but you really have no worries about lining up a shot or a stray bullet? I know one dog that got it's leg blown off and one dog that actually got killed from shooting over a bay. I think I've let Steve shoot over Sadie once, can't remember exactly, but he's the only one I trust to do that. And it's not because he's a great shot, it's because he knows without a doubt that if he shoots my dog then he's next! Plus, though this may not be as logical, I feel a lot safer with the pits. They take care of business every single time. If it was a big boar, I'd trust them over the possibility for human error.

[TRAPPERJOHN29]

put another slash mark by the pits for me aswell! I always feel comfortable legging a hog that is being held by my lead in!! I have not seen him come loose without a break stick yet and it gives me a chance to feed the hog a couple of weeks and clean it out before slaughtering it!! yeah ima have to say catch dog for sure! MY OPINION

[BobbyB]

If someone hits a dog with a stray bullet, they dont have much business carrying a gun. Now if the whole scene shifts at the time of a shot, that would be different.

My bird dogs are not broke to flush, meaning, when the bird flushes, they are moving. That is my choice in training and I have to shoot over running dogs with a shotgun. Shooting a bayed hog would be about the same if not easier , most of the time, in my brief experience and personal opinion.

Just like anything else, most of the safety issues depend on the operator, or shooter in this case.

[Marshall]

I have never taken a gun ever. Most of the time I forget my knife! ha  I would think a catchdog or maybe even 2 CDs would be safer than a gun....Maybe the 2nd catchdog would knock your Lacys out of the way when he catches??

[Purebreedcolt]

I have done both and as far as dogs getting cut much I think that totaly depends on the dogs being gritty or not.  Funny thing is we use a 222 over 20 guage for shooting over the dogs the 222 is loaded with hornedy vmax as when it penetrates it explodes inside and vertually elimiates the bullet comeing out the other side with even just a decent size hog.  a dog is going to get cut allmost no matter what it is just a matter of time eather way you go about it and personally I like to pack them out alive but that is just me

[jsh]

A 30-30 shell to the head or a catch dog?  If you take your time and check all dogs before you shoot - how is it unsafe to your dogs?  If you don't have a good, clear, lethal shot - don't shoot.  I hunt both ways, but prefer shooting any day.  A well placed head shot is a much cleaner, quicker kill than a knife.  I use two baydogs when I shoot.  The dogs tend to put put less pressure in lesser numbers and the hog is more than likely (not always) going to stand still, providing a better shot.  I have to agree with Cutter Bay that NOBODY shoots over my dogs but me.  Used to guide hunts in the Hill Country and it was unbelievable the shots that guys would want to try and take when it would have obviously been a disaster.  
It takes a person who can calmly and confidently assess the bay as far as dog location, what's in the background, shot placement, etc......

[dgdawsonBMCs]

I use 30-30 or a 357 lever action....and no, I don't just pull up and start firing at anything that moves....guns don't kill, people do...I would think I wouldn't have to explain that on this website...Obviously, if you don't know what you are doing with a firearm then you don't need to be in the woods anyway.

[HogzgoneWild]

This is just me but my dogs mean to much to me and are like family, and there is always that chance, I would never shoot over one of my dogs...I know what yall are thinkin there is the chance from a hog too, but thats what they love not bullets...... just my 95 cents...

[BarrNinja]

Bay and Shoot.
    Dogs bay. Hunter shoots. Dead pig. Safe in my mind. I have only shot and killed 7 or so hogs with my dogs but I have never worried about hitting one of them. You aren't shooting from 80yards. And if you have to work too hard at getting a clear shot your dogs shouldnt be getting shot over in the first place.

When the bulldog hits the pigs the dogs catch with them. That is when I think most cuts happen. When the hog is shot it drops. End of story. Your friend out near me(TG) shoots over his dogs. It has worked for him.
  We have hit hogs with 30carbines,7mm and 30-30 and havent had a problem when them being alive when they hit the dirt. I like dropping bulldogs thats why I dont shoot over the dogs much. But when I am alone I will bring the gun. I feel that shooting over the dogs is more safe then using catchdogs.

Ditto!

I haven't shot a hog over a dog in more than two years but In my experience it has been much safer for the dogs and hunters than using catch dogs. That being said I think it is ill advised and of poor judgment to use a gun with your dogs at night. At night a catch dog or two is the only way in my opinion.

Due to work I had about a 10 year gap were I was only able to shoot hogs most of the time unless I had a friend along that owned a catch or two. I personally couldn't keep the dog power at home to go it alone catching them so I found myself in the woods with 1 or 2 dogs and my rifle most of the time.
After years of only catching and tying hogs it didn't take me long to realise that I didnt use my cut kit at all when I was just shooting hogs. Ill also add that I used the same gritty dogs both ways. Just less of them when using my rifle.
I love to catch and tie but no one can convince me that catch dogs are safer than using a gun. As with any type of firearm sport, safety has always got to be a first as others have already stated.
I have literally shot and killed well over 1000 hogs over dogs and have never came close to risking injury to a person or dog due to firearms. Ive seen and heard of others falling short of that though but the odds in my experience work out much better for the dogs when the rifle is out and the catch dogs are left at home.
In 23 years of hog hunting I have never seen a dog killed by a hog wile being shot over. Only one by rifle and it was a freak accident. (Check out my Magic bullet thread in guns on hogs).
As for catch dogs? I really dont want to highlight those numbers here but just check out the R.I.P. post on this board alone from the guys that use catch dogs for starters. Just stating the obvious in my mind folks.

Before anyone beats me up about my post here................I own catch dogs and tie hogs.



 

 

[Eric]

I have hunted both ways since I started hunting... they are equally dangerous. Its all about the dogs. IF your dogs are always getting cut up with catch dogs... they will get cut up shooting... and vise-versa.

I have seen dogs get cut because they learned to grab onto to hogs after you shoot because they think its dead. Well, you don't get a good shot on the hog... they dog pile... and the hog still has some fight in him. These were typically the same dogs that catch when catch dogs catch.

As for shooting your dogs... a gun in the wrong hands is just as dangerous as a knife in the wrong hands.

That is just my sole opinion based on my limited experience.

[Caughtandhobbled]

True Blue,
Great topic....I see a lot of good points being made. I have never met Trapper John, but I like him. I do agree with him on feeding a hog out for a couple of weeks. I give away hogs that we kill with knives on properties that we have to produce numbers (feed the homeless). Hogs caught at my place are caught and cut and marked most of the time (we never cut tails), then released. When we want some fresh pork, the hog will always be fed out before butchering. LATER...

[uglydog]

The problem with shooting over the dogs is,  not always will you get a clear shot, and if you don't have a clear shot, don't take it.  Depending on the terrain you are in you may only get a slight glimpse of a hog, and spend alot of time trying to get one to bay in a place that you have a view of a hog. You may have many good bays in a row and may be several times you are just "stuck" waiting on the situation to change, when you could have sent in a catch dog and caught the hog. I feel like shooting takes alot more patience and skill. I m not against it, but I know way to many folks that get overly excited when they get close to a bay, they scare me with a knife in their hands, No way will they be allowed to have a firearm around me or my dogs.

I know a guy that shoots over his dogs, usually just one dog sometimes two loose baying dogs, but as soon as the gun fires the dogs jump on the hog and that is the only time that his dog gets cut, on the last adreneline pumping breaths of the hog, and the the few that the shot was not fatal.

[txboardog]

I've taken many hogs using both methods and had just as many dogs cut by one way as the other. But on another note I won't let but a select few   peole shoot over my dogs just because a lot of people get way to excited and get tunnel vision and then that's when bad things happen. I've seen it happen and there is nothing worse than seeing a good dog shot just because someone has lost all sanity and forgot about their surrondings. I prefer to catch and tie but now that hogs are not bringing anything I have been just taking two to three dogs and shooting the hogs but I am confident in my shooting ability and I also know my dogs so I get along real good that way. Good topic

[dgdawsonBMCs]

If you don't have a clear shot, you don't shoot until you do..

[shawn]

i prefer catchdogs, Buddy is probably more accurate grabbing an ear than my shaky alcoholic hand is at shooting anyway.

[sfboarbuster]

I dont think i would like to try crawling through the palmettos down here in florida with a gun, let alone try to shoot a hog in there. 99% of the hogs a catch are in thick stuff you can barely walk in