Deer July hound for hogs

[chestonmcdowell]

I’m finally starting on my pack and have been looking for a walker pup but I found some July running walkers out of some deer hunting stock. I can hardly find anything on July hounds and was wanting to know y’all a opinion. I don’t mind trail barking

[Slim9797]

Not that I know a whole lot at all. And even less about running dogs. But I do know there is good and bad and great and really bad in every breed and strain. Here around south central Texas, alot of old lines of stock bred cur dogs have some old blood July crossed in them some where years ago. The right line of any running bred dog is gonna have plenty lung, nose, and bottom. All of which were very desirable traits when talking catching and gathering wild cattle and hogs. So rather than breed, to me it comes down from who are they coming from.


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[Slim9797]

Note. All the dogs we run are silent until they’ve jumped the hog but will bark behind a runner. If they shut up that hog is pretty well ahead of them. So open to me doesn’t matter. My # 1 trait is an intangible and it’s just knowing how to get bayed and stay that way. If I can’t see a dog sit down and bay and know I could go to town get some lunch and come back to the dog bayed. I probably won’t own the dog. The few straight running blooded dogs I have seen had a problem with staying bayed solo. They would get bored and leave looking for another track to run if no help arrived within a timely fashion


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[chestonmcdowell]

I understand what your saying. And that’s what I’m afraid of but they will be trained with rougher dogs so hopefully they pick up. I’m not all that sure that deer will actually stop and fight either so sticking around and baying may not even be in their dna. I think they will have a ton of bottom and a good nose I’ve never hunted behind these dogs before but supposedly they’re jam up deer dogs. They’re only 5 weeks so maybe I can form them the way I need them if that’s possible. Thanks for the input

[Cajun]

   The good thing is, they are from outside dogs and not pen dogs. The fox & coyote pens have just about bred the nose off of running dogs. I've tried Julys but like Slim said, coud not find one that would stay bayed by thereselves. I do have a buddy that has one and he uses it as a turn in dog after the hog breaks and runs. This dog will stay bayed so they are out there.

[RBz_OFFROAD]

My gather on some July breeds were that they weren’t 3 day competition dogs... More of a dog that would give you their all in 4-6 hours. I don’t know a consistent strand that brings everything to the table needed to be a hog dog.

[chestonmcdowell]

That would be fine to me I’m just a weekend warrior and may go during weekday once a blue moon. Hopefully they will put teeth on one and since they’re deer dogs fast enough to stop one. I’ll keep y’all posted someone told me today that walkers mature pretty fast compared to other hounds which I hope is true.

[TheRednose]

There are reasons why certain breeds in certain areas are used the majority of time. Everybody wants to re-invent the wheel and I am not saying there is anything wrong with that because that is how new things are discovered but..... My advice to you would be not to try and do that right off the bat with your first dogs. I would find some dogs locally or from another area similar to yours and try them. Figure out if you want open trail barking hounds or silent curs, you can find exceptions to both of these but that can be a long painful process.

July's can be nice dogs I have seen a few crosses of them used on hogs but never seen a pure one ran on them though I have heard of it. If for whatever reason your dead set on a July do some research and find someone who is or has used them on hogs and that might be you best starting point. Good luck either way.

[Goose87]

Just about every dog I own has walker/July in them, like has been mentioned already, it’s not about the breed of a dog in general or even a line within a breed, it’s more to do with the individual itself, especially when dealing with running dogs, you have to take into consideration that your taking a dog to do a job that’s it’s not necessarily genetically wired to do, I have a gyp that I use to put into a jumped race because she doesn’t have to nose to push a cold track fast, I don’t need her for a jump dog, he reason for being in my pack is because of her trackspeed on a hot track, and the fact that she will bay all day long like a cur dog, even if the hog settles and lays down she’s stays with it, she’s bred for the speed and drive trials so trailing abilities aren’t bred for, I called a very good friend of mine that has an eye for dogs that I trust and told him what I was wanting and it took him about 2 years to find what I wanted, a guy that was getting into hunting and going with me, went to the mans yard that bred my female up and got a pile of nieces and nephews off my females brother an sister and they will not bay a lick, will run the hide off something all day but as soon as it stops they lose interest, same breeding as my female who bays better than a lot of curs but totally different type of dogs, don’t be disappointed or discouraged if your first few don’t pan out, tracking running is going to come natural with running walker/July dogs, focus on the dogs baying ability when selecting this type of dog, if it’s pups your getting to raise up try to find someone who raises gritty salty run to catch walkers, if your looking to get dogs reasonably local I’d suggest finding someone who bobcats hunts with running walkers, you’ll put yourself way ahead in a faster time than trying to go through a pile of dogs that don’t have it, now a days the majority of dogs bred in the south east are pen bred and don’t have the tools to make hog dogs, there’s always exceptions in everything but looking at averages the numbers aren’t good, if you don’t mind traveling I’d suggest finding some guys who have running walker coyote hounds from the northern states, these dogs are bred and developed to run down and catch coyotes in the wild and have the necessary tools in one package, to track, trail, run and bay big game...

A good friend of mine has an outstanding established line of running walkers that were bred for bobcat hunting, I crossed that blood over two cur gyps and the results have been way above my expectations...


If your not stuck on having full running walker/July’s then I’d suggest finding a good running walker and crossing over a good baying cur and weed through the whole litter to find what you want...

[Goose87]

These 3 are full siblings and are half running walker, I have a 4th one on another guys yard...



This is my Kate gyp, she’s half running walker and half plot, this is a picture this past summer, this is her mother she’s full running walker...


 These two females are full siblings and are half running walker and are off the same male the three above are...

[t-dog]

Goose those are really nice looking dogs! Can you describe their style? Like their range, track speed, nose, baying style, bite, silent/open, etc....Too, can you say where they got the characteristics from? I guess what I mean is which breed contributed each characteristic? Another question is, have you tried the cross both ways, hound on top curr on bottom and curr on top hound on bottom? I was raised with a certain train of thought and just curious if you notice or got the same results.

[TheRednose]

Good looking dogs Goose, as you know I am a fan of these crosses. I like the direction you are going with them.

[RBz_OFFROAD]

Goose I am glad you responded to this post.    I know you are familiar with the crosses and running dogs. This Gyp I have is 1/4 July if I am not mistaking right Goose?

[chestonmcdowell]

Goose I will have a long talk with the owners if they decide to sell one and see if they think they will match up. Honestly they’ll probably be pleased if I decided to pass on them. I don’t think they’re into the selling game. I like how’re they’re built like a grey hound they definitely look like they have endurance. I’m not set on getting them I definitely want to take my time and find a good one, but it seems like all the dogs are in Texas lmao. I just know I want hound or cur crosses maybe a little pit mix. We have a lot of thickets and hardwood openings around here with river bottoms. So something that can give good short spurts on speed and some teeth would be appreciated

[Goose87]

Goose those are really nice looking dogs! Can you describe their style? Like their range, track speed, nose, baying style, bite, silent/open, etc....Too, can you say where they got the characteristics from? I guess what I mean is which breed contributed each characteristic? Another question is, have you tried the cross both ways, hound on top curr on bottom and curr on top hound on bottom? I was raised with a certain train of thought and just curious if you notice or got the same results.

T-Dog I can only give you a detail of the 3 above being as their the oldest and have the most experience, their track running style is exactly what I was after when I made this cross,once they have a track they can smell good they are relentless in pushing it and once they get a hog up and running they can get up on him quick, they have a real keen sense of track running and don’t make many losses and run with their head up, if they make a bobble in the track they start making loops where they lost it at and it’s usually not long and they have it back up, I can’t really say how far they range out because they’ve struck hogs literally as soon as their feet hit the ground out the box and have gone upwards of a mile before opening on a track, I’ll say this, finding a hog is on their mind when casted, they’re not naturally as rangy by themselves as my other curs are, their baying style is really my only concern about them, they all bay good and bay tight when in company but individually bay loose, my big male is actually the loosest baying off them, Christmas Eve we got on a flat out bad boar and Ben was one of 2 dogs that didn’t get wrecked, I’m going to breed Ben back to his mother this year to bring back in some more bay because she bays with a vengeance and later on down the rd breed him back to his sisters and go from there, they are f1 crosses and I’m afraid if I breed back toward the sire or dams side I’ll lose some of the vigor and not bragging at all but they are some of the nicest dogs I’ve ever hunted with and there wasn’t a single dud in the litter of 5 I weaned and got to the woods, one male was hit by a log truck running a coyote behind my house when he was 10 months old...

The pictures of the last two are off the best female I’ve ever owned or personally hunted with, after seeing the results in the first cross with that line of walkers I took my gyp and bred to the same male, the red tick looking one got her chest cavity punctured Monday, these two belong to my two closest friends and I have 2 more myself and one of the same guys has another sister and this will be their first season on them...

As far as the crosses go I’ve seen it done with a full brother and sister that were curs and each were bred to two full brother and sister that were plotts and the results were completely different types of dogs in style and body build, years later I found out that a dog only inherits it’s mitochondrial DNA from the mother, this isn’t theory or speculation it’s FACT, that goes for all mammals, I had always been told that the caliber of the female being bred is what needs to be focused on and that a great female will make a mediocre male look good in the brood box but a great male cannot fix the faults of a mediocre female, and them men who always told me that all had yards of top dogs, I’m not talking about hog hunting but men who were bird hunters, squirrel hunters, cat hunters, and bulldog men, after researching mDNA, it finally clicked with what those men had unknowingly been practicing for years, I’m still unfamiliar with it myself but have discovered some info that makes all the sense in the world...

What are your thoughts on it?

[Goose87]

Goose I am glad you responded to this post.    I know you are familiar with the crosses and running dogs. This Gyp I have is 1/4 July if I am not mistaking right Goose?

Yes Scotty she’s 1/4 July or walker can’t remember, I thinks it’s walker, her mother come from Ford and Lane Fortenberry...

[Goose87]

Goose I will have a long talk with the owners if they decide to sell one and see if they think they will match up. Honestly they’ll probably be pleased if I decided to pass on them. I don’t think they’re into the selling game. I like how’re they’re built like a grey hound they definitely look like they have endurance. I’m not set on getting them I definitely want to take my time and find a good one, but it seems like all the dogs are in Texas lmao. I just know I want hound or cur crosses maybe a little pit mix. We have a lot of thickets and hardwood openings around here with river bottoms. So something that can give good short spurts on speed and some teeth would be appreciated

If I wasn’t so deep in this project that I’m in and was just getting into hog hunting I’d have a yard full of bird dog and bulldog crosses, those seem to be effective in whatever region they’re hunted in but don’t have a long shelf life, I surpassed along time ago the need to catch hogs at whatever cost, nowadays I like to do it a certain way with a certain style of dog, no different than a guy fly fishing for bass or pitching crankbaits, just different preferences, if your heart is set on having walker dog crosses and you don’t have many resources to choose from find some guys that run coyotes in the pens and tell them you’ll take their dogs that are to rough on a yote, in the Fox/coyote pen world a dogs that runs down and kills game in the pen is seen as a cull and cost the pen owners game and dog owners money having to pay for that game, those dogs usually make pretty good hog dogs, all throughout the years I’ve owned several fox pen killers that made some nice dogs and never had any problem with them baying...

[t-dog]

Goose I think we like and are trying to raise the same kind of dog. I was raised with that same teaching about the female emphasis. I have found it to be exactly true. It's one of the biggest reasons I hunt mostly females. Everyone likes a male for obvious reasons. I place my pups so that I get to see them hunt and make my own judgment about them. So I have the females and can breed back to the males of my choice. I REALLY like the looks of your dogs, definitely my flavor.

[Goose87]

Good looking dogs Goose, as you know I am a fan of these crosses. I like the direction you are going with them.

When I get a little more tweak and tuning done on them, some will be headed west

[The Old Man]

Goose what about the redtick? Redtick is not a running dog color nor a curdog color.